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Category 7 => Analysing specific Hadith narrations - => Topic started by: Zeynab on March 19, 2011, 01:42:09 am



Title: Hadith on punishments in the grave
Post by: Zeynab on March 19, 2011, 01:42:09 am
Gross misinterpretation of Quranic verses by the Hadith "scholars"
 
There are plenty of Ahadith on punishments in the grave which are completely incompatible with the contents of the Glorious Quran.  The Quran says NOTHING about punishments in the grave.  Before I discuss Hadith discrepancies that pertain to this topic and their likely origin, I will mention the old trick of our jurists who have purposely picked some verses of the Quran and have tried to misinterpret them as "punishments in the grave" only for the purpose of making them conform with certain Hadith narrations.

(1)  "If you could see, when the wrong-doers reach the pangs of death and the angels stretch their hands out (saying): Deliver up your souls. This day ye are awarded doom of degradation for that you spake concerning Allah other than the truth, and used to scorn His portents."  (6:93)   

Hadith explanation of the above verse is:  Ibn Hajar who quotes Tabrani narrating from Ibn Abbas :  "This will occur at the time of death. And the meaning of stretching forth their hands is smiting their faces and backs."

Completely false presumption.  There is absolutely no reference to the grave in verse 6:93. The verse is describing the situation when a disbeliever will reach the pangs of death and the angel of death will come to take back his soul.  The angel of death will come at the behest of Allah to collect everyone's soul at the time of their appointed death, believers and disbelievers.  The disbelievers will be told of their punishment which will occur on the Day of Resurrection.  The punishment for some violators e.g. Pharaoh and the folks of Noah, will begin soon after death, prior to the Day of Resurrection.  And again there's no reference to that being in the grave.  What lies in the grave are only the physical remains which turn into dust but it's the soul that lives on in the custody of Allah.  But where or how Allah keeps that soul is only known to Him.  If we try to comment on that, it will only give rise to speculations, which is Haram.  Thus, those few persons whose punishment will begin soon after death, their souls will be subjected to torment, most likely in Hellfire or some other place known to Allah alone.  But it's very obviously and definitely not the physical earthly grave which we see with our eyes.  This will be explained further as we proceed.

(2)  "If you could see how the angels receive those who disbelieve, smiting faces and their backs and (saying): Taste the punishment of burning!"  (8:50)

This verse is also similar to verse 6:93.  "Smiting faces and their backs" refers to the harsh welcome disbelievers will receive as soon as their souls depart from their bodies and they exit this world for the next.  "Taste the punishment of burning!" does not refer to punishment inside the grave.  As the Quran clearly states in many Surahs, after death till the time when one wakes up on the Day of Resurrection will seem like a few hours or few days.  When the angels come to take the souls of those who disbelieve and warn them of their punishment, that is to be understood as the punishment of Hellfire on the day when they are raised.  Not the punishment inside the physical grave.

(3)  "Because of their sins they were drowned, then made to enter a Fire. And they found they had no helpers in place of Allah." (71:25)

Verse 71:25 refers to the people of Noah who were drowned in the big flood.  Again, the reference here is that their punishment will commence soon after death in Hellfire.  There's absolutely no concept of anyone being punished inside a tiny grave made of earthly mud, dust and sand.

(4)  "The Fire; they are exposed to it morning and evening; and on the day when the Hour uprises (it is said): Cause Pharaoh's folk to enter the most awful doom."  (40:46)

The above verse 40:46 refers to Pharaoh and his followers.  It is expressed that Pharaoh and those who obeyed him will be exposed to the torment of Hellfire morning and evening to begin soon after their death.  On the Day of Judgment their exposure to Hell will be the greatest.
 
The Verse is not indicative of their punishment taking place within their physical graves or pyramids etc.

When will the punishment of afterlife begin?

In some cases Almighty Allah has elucidated clearly in the Glorious Quran that punishment will begin soon after death, as in the case of Pharaoh and his followers and the disobedient people of the town of Prophet Noah who were drowned, the verses concerning which have already been quoted above.   

But the Glorious Quran also makes the standard norm for majority of the wrong doers very plain.  Their punishment will begin after Resurrection. 

"Has not the story reached you of those who disbelieved of old and so did taste the ill-effects of their conduct, and theirs will be a painful doom."  (64:5)

Please focus on the last few words of the above verse, "and theirs will be a painful doom."   The future tense of this expression indicates that the doom for such people is yet to begin.   Punishments that are yet to come for those who have passed away must begin on the Day of Resurrection as per the Laws of the Divine Power asserted throughout His Final Message.

Hadith on punishments inside the grave

Some of the Hadith on punishments in the grave which I am quoting for your information are completely absurd and falsely attributed to the Prophet (sw).  These Ahadith are simply the concoctions of the narrators and compilers.  In some cases even the name of the narrator/narrators (or isnad) have very definitely been forged.  For example, where Aisha's name appears as the narrator, it's got to be a lie.  The Prophet (sw) would never make such unwarranted statements and thus, there is no question of Aisha quoting him.  Such ones have likely been forged by Abu Huraira and his contemporaries in the names of those who were close to the Prophet (S) only for the purpose of getting their false narrations accepted.  They may have even been further manipulated by the compilers as well; the bungling of contents within the Hadith is really so massive!

The following are some such Hadiths on punishments in the grave

(1)  Transmitted by Sahih Bukhari Narrated by Ayesha [Vol 8:#377]
Two old ladies from among the Jewish ladies entered upon me and said, "The dead are punished in their graves," but I thought they were telling a lie and did not believe them in the beginning. When they went away and the Prophet (Sal-allahu-aleihi-wasallam) entered upon me, I said, "O Allah's Apostle! (Sal-allahu-aleihi-wasallam) Two old ladies..." and told him the whole story. He said, "They told the truth; the (sinful) dead are really punished, to the extent that all the animals hear (the sound resulting from) their punishment." Since then I always saw him seeking refuge with Allah from the punishment of the grave in his prayers.


(2) Narrated by Abu Hurairah - Transmitted by Sahih Bukhari  - Narrated by Abu Hurairah :  Allah's Apostle (Sal-allahu-aleihi-wasallam) used to invoke (Allah): "O Allah! I seek refuge with you from the punishment in the grave and from the punishment in the Hell fire and from the afflictions of life and death, and the afflictions of Al-Masih Ad-Dajjal." 

(3)  A Tirmidhi hadith says:  (narrator's name is not available) Rasulullah  said, 'If you are made to listen to the punishment in the grave, you will stop burying your deceased.'

Here's another long and fabricated hadith on punishment in the grave from a collection known as Mishkat al-Masabih written by someone named Khatib al-Tabrizi.   In this particular collection, he is supposed to have compiled information for those who didn't have much knowledge of Hadith.  So, you can imagine the quantum of bluff it must contain!   This collection is said to have over 1500 hadiths, many of which even Al-Tabrizi did not consider authentic, yet the Sunni imams have preserved this collection as "authentic," ignoring the incompatibility of its contents with the Quran.  The following is a narration from Mishkat al-Masabih with no conformity with the information given to us in the Noble Quran.

(4)  "Rasulullah (SAW) said, 'When a person is buried and the people go away, two angels approach the deceased and ask three questions,

a) Who is your lord?
b) What is your religion? and
c) Who is he (Rasulullah)?

A believer will answer all three questions and he will be honored with the clothing of Jannah. The window of Jannah will be opened for him and he will enjoy the sight of Jannah. On the contrary, a disbeliever will express regret at not being able to answer the questions. Upon that, an angel who is blind and deaf is appointed to punish him.  Blind so that the angel does not see the punishment and feel mercy and deaf so that the punishment is not heard. The hammer used to punish a disbeliever is so heavy that it can reduce a mountain to dust. The disbeliever screams with pain and every creation can hear him besides human and Jinns."


In NO Surah does the Quran mention any such activities in the grave.

There are plenty of other similar ones in the collections Bukhari and Muslim bin Hajaj.  But I won't waste my time quoting them.

Possible origin of the concept of punishments in the grave

By researching history, it shows that the concept of punishments in the grave originates from non-Divine religions and ancient traditions.  According to many polytheist cultures, it was believed that life continued in the grave and those buried needed food, clothes and all other necessities and luxuries of life after death. 

The Anglo Saxon pagans, for example, had certain funerary practices where the dead were either buried or cremated with a selection of grave items which included food, jewellery, clothes, kitchen utensils, weaponry etc.   The remains, whether inhumed or cremated, were placed in a variety of sites including graveyards, burial mounds (which are graves made of earth and stones) and sometimes they were also buried in ships known as 'ship burials.'   This practice lasted until the 7th century.   Anglo Saxons converted to Christianity around the 8th century.  But the Christians imported several ancient practices into their faith.  Various versions of the altered Bibles believe in grave punishments like the Hadith.  According to Christian funeral rites, the body is dressed in costly attire while it lies in the casket.  Remains of women are also adorned with make-up.  These are all abbreviated ideas brought down from pagan times.

Another example is that of the ancient Egyptians 5,000 years ago who were pagans.  They had similar ideas of life in the grave as the Anglo Saxon pagans.  Their belief in life in the grave led to many preparations for burial.  It resulted  in the construction of the pyramids and large tombs for kings and queens.   The common people had small tombs.  All tombs and pyramids were filled with items like clothing, wigs, food, cosmetics, jewelry etc. The tombs of rich Egyptians also had statues representing servants.  Many of the bodies were embalmed or mummified .... and various other such nonsense.    The idea behind all such practices was that they thought there was life in the grave.

The Wahabis who are staunch Hadith adherents, may not build monuments over graves, but they do believe in all those un-Quranic grave activities as narrated in the phony Ahadith. 

By the way, monumenting graves is a different matter.  It's basically for the purpose of marking the grave as a remembrance so that it doesn't get demolished or the space might be reclaimed by others.

Quranic evidence that nothing happens in the grave

Please read the following verses of the Glorious Quran very carefully.

"The day when they come forth from the graves in haste, as racing to a goal, With eyes aghast, abasement stupefying them: Such is the Day which they are promised."  (70:43-44).

The above verses confirm that the grave was a place of silence and oblivion.  It's only after being resurrected that the people will be in a state of confusion.

"The day when the Trumpet is blown. On that day we assemble the guilty white-eyed (with terror), Murmuring among themselves: Ye have tarried but ten (days)."   (20:102-103)


These verses 20:102-103 elucidate the bafflement when everyone is gathered together for questioning.  They may have been dead thousands or millions of years ago, but they will feel that they had been asleep only for a few days and just awoken.   

The following verse 30:55 also conveys the same message.

"And on the day when the Hour rises the guilty will vow that they did tarry but an hour - thus were they ever deceived."  (30:55)

And now read the following verse  36:51-52.

"And the trumpet is blown and lo! from the graves they hie unto their Rab, Crying: Woe upon us! Who has raised us from our place of sleep ? This is that which the Beneficent did promise, and the messengers spoke truth."    (36:51:52)

Verses 36:51-52 of Surah Ya Sin are clear and simple indication that the souls of majority of the people will rest in a state of peaceful oblivion until the Final Hour when the Trumpet will sound, and then they will rise from our graves with a feeling that they were resting comfortably till woken up.

The references in all Verses quoted above are that during Resurrection everyone will feel that they have been woken up from a peaceful slumber.  If the commotion as described in Hadith took place in everyone's grave, wouldn't Allah Almighty refer to them in these verses?  So, why has Allah not mentioned any of those contents of the Hadith in none of the Quran verses?  Because those Ahadith are a bunch of myths that need to be shredded.

Concept of soul in the Glorious Quran

With direct Quranic references: 

There are two very important verses in the Noble Quran that confirm the existence of the soul  quoted as follows:-

"Allah receives (men's) souls at the time of their death, and that (soul) which dies not (yet) in its sleep. He keeps that (soul) for which He has ordained death and dismisses the rest till an appointed term. Lo! herein verily are portents for people who take thought." (39:42)

Verse 39:42 is one of the very beautiful verses of the Glorious Quran.   It explains death with sleep as an analogy.  Allah receives the souls of people when their bodies perish.  But the soul does not perish with the body.  Death is ordained only for the body.  The body withers away for a certain period while the soul continues to live.  On the Day of Judgment Allah is able to recreate that same body exactly like before.   Death being ordained for the soul refers to the body that contains that soul.  And of course, Allah does not disclose to us where He keeps the soul.  The idea of Barzak as a transitory place for the soul is another Hadith story with no support from the Noble Quran.

"They are asking you concerning the Spirit. Say: The Spirit is by command of my Rab, and of knowledge you have been vouchsafed but little."  (17:85)

The above verse 17:85 of Surah Bani Israel confirms the existence of the soul which is at Allah's command.  But Allah asserts that humans have been granted no further knowledge about it, period.   No further discussions needed on the soul.

"We mete out death among you, and We are not to be outrun,
That We may transfigure you and make you what ye know not."  (56:60-61)


To my understanding, the above verses 56:60-61 of Surah Al-Waqi'ah also hints at the soul.  I would explain it as:  Death is unavoidable, and after death one is transformed into something different.   Apparently this refers to the withered and shriveled physical remains.  Also, there could be a reference to the soul which is no longer inside the physical body.   Allah knows best.  But we can be sure that none of these verses even remotely confirm the stories of Bukhari etc.

May Allah, The Exalted, guide us with the Truth, Light and Beauty of His Final Message only.



Also check Sister Heba's articles Punishment in grave for wetting clothes with urine? (http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=4597.msg16147#msg16147)

"Fitnah of the grave" - Beware!  False hadith concept (http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=4628.msg16181;boardseen#new)


Title: Re: Hadith on punishment in the graves
Post by: Heba E. Husseyn on March 20, 2011, 01:31:51 am
Thanks sis Zeynab.  As usual, very logical piece that brings out the discrepancies of this Hadith so vividly.  Several of these hadiths claim that the Prophet (SAW) could hear voices of those being punished from their graves.  It totally contradicts the information in the Noble Quran.  There's a verse in the Quran (I can't recall the verse so I will paraphrase) which says that when people go into their graves, it's complete silence and can you hear anything from them?  

That point about the origin of hadiths on punishment in graves is also seems like an accurate research.  Of course it's no secret that many Hadiths, like the contents of the altered Old & New Testaments, have their roots in old pagan practices.


Title: Re: Hadith on punishment in the graves
Post by: N. Truth Seeker on March 20, 2011, 01:53:08 am
Yes, very nice post.  The clarifications are really educative.  There are many ahadith on punishments inside the grave and they are all real bad ones. 

Btw, sister Zeynab, what does "ship burials" mean?


Title: Re: Hadith on punishment in the graves
Post by: Ruhi_Rose on March 20, 2011, 03:56:22 am
Yeah, thanks sis.  Very good article on this crazy yap yap of Bukhari.  If u read the entire bunch of "grave punishment" hadiths, you'll be amazed how the Hadithists can be so un-Quranic to actually accept such Hadiths. 

Br. Pt, ship burials refer to the practice of burying people in vault-like places in ships .... made somewhat like a small basement.  Some of these anglo-saxons used to put the dead in such places.  I think the previous pope who died is also buried in an underground vault at the vatican.  I read something similar about his burial. 


Title: Re: Hadith on punishment in the graves
Post by: muslima on August 09, 2012, 08:32:32 am
 BismEm
thanks a lot excellent post jazak Allah khair sis zeynab !! just seeing how reliable they are.uncountable lies  ^:(
This is a matter of the unseen . No one have any knowledge about unseen except Allah. Quran does not mention the torture of grave anywhere how could hadith and scholar explained it ? dead body eaten by insects inside the grave is natural circle otherwise this world would be stink ? why do people,ulma's ,scholars presumed it grave punishment ??

correct me if i am wrong ??concept of grave punishment is against the marcy and justice of Allah.
Torture on dead body inside the grave by squeezing ,smashing ,eaten by snakes and scorpions morning till evening ?? several lives and deaths with unbearable pain and when (deadbody )he /she die with pain Allah give them life agian for the same punishment ??? before the Day of Resurrection? body exprienced death and life many times inside the grave ?? and what about someone who died 100 years ago !Allah punishing him/her by giving many lives and deaths in grave ? and he/she still experiencing pain ,same punishments?? each day and night ?? up till now such period of grave punishment ? hadith claim of grave punishment against the justice of Allah !! no one knows When the day will come (Qayamah/day of judgement )and what about those worst sinners whoes not die yet or will die 2 minutes before the Day of judgement? or die on the day of judgement ??don't they deserve grave punishment ??? isn't seems unfair .?? What would be the purpose of Day of Judgment if after death, one were to receive their punishment in their graves ?
Allah warned us in quran to Be fearful and awareful of the fire of hell NOT GRAVE
every punishment ON the DAY OF Judgement
two words (the Sentence will be) and ON the day of judgement

Every soul will taste of death. And ye will be paid on the Day of Resurrection only that which ye have fairly earned. Whoso is removed from the Fire and is made to enter paradise, he indeed is triumphant. The life of this world is but comfort of illusion 3:185

one more Quranic evidence !!

-Or (bethink thee of) the like of him who, passing by a township which had fallen into utter ruin, exclaimed: How shall Allah give this township life after its death? And Allah made him die a hundred years, then brought him back to life. He said: How long hast thou tarried? (The man) said: I have tarried a day or part of a day. (He) said: Nay, but thou hast tarried for a hundred years. Just look at thy food and drink which have not rotted! Look at thine ass! And, that We may make thee a token unto mankind, look at the bones, how We adjust them and then cover them with flesh! And when (the matter) became clear unto him, he said: I know now that Allah is Able to do all things.2:259

A man slept for a 100 years but he only felt like that he slept for a part of a day ? rest of body and soul ?? no evidence of grave punishment ?

 i didn't found any clue  about soul in which place Allah kept the soul ? what gonna happend to us after death nothing mention ??  and more surprising for me is Azabe - barzakh  thats something crazy what is Azabe - barzakh ?? its also not mention in Quran ?


Title: Re: Hadith on punishment in the graves
Post by: Zeynab on August 09, 2012, 08:28:16 pm
Thanks a lot for the additional feedback sister Muslima.  I too find this idea of grave punishment completely absurd.   The hadith narrators and compilers quite certainly got these concepts from non-Islamic faiths.  They didn't have the slightest of clue concerning the Quranic information on death.  That's because they never read the Quran.   It's sad to see how these people have messed up everything with their own imaginary stories.


Title: Re: Hadith on punishment in the graves
Post by: muslima on August 12, 2012, 10:43:51 am
sorry to get back to you late u are welcome sis Zeynab !! grave punishment idea is absolutely against the Quran.we just need to look carefully and we can see that. Quran contains all the correct information about everything and is a guide for individuals.it's a prove the information outside Quran is highly dangerous,unreliable for all beleiver .Quran is the only source to reach the truth.


Title: Re: Hadith on punishments in the grave
Post by: Ruhi_Rose on October 04, 2017, 09:56:09 pm
Salams dear everyone.  Just have a few points to discuss on the Quranic Verses. 


"We mete out death among you, and We are not to be outrun,  That We may transfigure you and make you what ye know not."  (56:60-61).

Can these Verses also mean the positive or negative changes in one's appearance after death or during Resurrection, depending on whether the person was a believer or disbeliever.  I mean, for instance, a believer who in this world had no money to groom themselves and thus looked simple and plain will look startlingly different and dazzling on the Day of Resurrection.  For a disbeliever, immersed in wealth and earthly care, it will be the opposite making them look disheveled and bedraggled.  Monetary wealth fades and is invalidated in the next world.  The wealth of a strong Monotheistic Faith and beautiful conduct are the rich possessions of the next world.  Thus the terms wealthy and poor in the afterlife will have completely different connotations. 



"And the trumpet is blown and lo! from the graves they hie unto their Rab, Crying: Woe upon us! Who has raised us from our place of sleep ?  (36:51-52).


Unfortunately several non-Muslims don't observe the procedure of burial, instead they follow the awful practice of cremation.  Still more unfortunate, this practice has also become quite common among Christians in the West, mainly secular Christians, basically as a means to save money.  They claim burial is more costly .. and for most of these folks just about everything revolves around money. 

My question is, does the mention of the word "graves" in Verse 36:51 include those who weren't buried?  Would appreciate if someone can give their opinion.  According to my husband's view, it definitely also includes those who weren't buried and on the Final Day they will find themselves rising from a resting place as nothing is impossible for Allah.


Title: Re: Hadith on punishments in the grave
Post by: Zeynab on October 04, 2017, 10:07:10 pm
Walaikum Salaam Sister Ruhi. 
That opinion of your husband sounds absolutely right.  Though only Allah knows best, I had much the same in mind.  Nothing is impossible, not even difficult, for Allah.  No one can limit the Limitless - "Kun Faya Kun" (Be and it is).  Whether a person was buried, cremated, blown into bits in an explosion, remains not found or whatever might have happened other than burial, Allah Almighty monitors every detail and has complete possession of the person's remains.

It is our duty that we bury our fellow human beings after death because as highlighted in the Noble Quran, the method of disposing of the dead is burial.  As you rightly mentioned, one of the many deviations of disbelievers and secularists is their decision of cremating instead of burying, also making it a monetary issue.  Within their own limited minds they may think cremation makes them disappear after death and that's the final end.  Such concepts arise because of the utter ignorance of the human mind. Their foolishness keeps them in the dark and doesn't allow them to measure the greatness of Allah.  They were never taught the greatness of Allah, so they think of Allah in terms of human limitations.  They will be in for a rude awakening, and they will be struck with unprecedented awe on the Day of Resurrection and Judgment when they will watch for themselves with what perfection and flawlessness Allah Almighty raises them, every individual in one piece, while they thought this could never happen.


Title: Re: Hadith on punishments in the grave
Post by: Heba E. Husseyn on October 04, 2017, 10:13:45 pm

Wonderfully perceived Sister Zeynab.  And same to Sister Ruhi's husband's opinion. 

This terrible practice of cremation is just so disgusting and disrespectful.  There are also some who never wished to be cremated during their lifetime, but after death, their careless or  greedy families had them cremated instead of burying the remains.  In such cases of course, the fault is of the greedy, selfish families.


Title: Re: Hadith on punishments in the grave
Post by: Zeynab on October 04, 2017, 10:15:15 pm

True Sister Heba.


Title: Re: Hadith on punishments in the grave
Post by: Ruhi_Rose on October 04, 2017, 10:16:59 pm

Many thanks for the very helpful input sisters.  Your opinions are so educative.  Will also share with my husband.  Yes, his thoughts are also on the same path as Sister Zeynab explained.


Title: Re: Hadith on punishments in the grave
Post by: Ruhi_Rose on August 13, 2018, 06:30:42 am


Salams all. 

Need to clarify something important ....

A hadithist sister I know was claiming the other day that Verses 100:9-11 of Surah Al-Adiyat refers to activities in the grave between death and Resurrection. 

Quoting the Verses:

"Knoweth he not that, when the contents of the graves are poured forth
And the secrets of the breasts are made known,
On that day will their Rab be perfectly informed concerning them."  (100:9-11).


For the information of our readers ...

These Verses do not literally mean the graves will be physically opened.  It refers to Resurrection, the soul being united with the body, and everyone raised back as living human beings in whatever state or wherever their physical remains may have been buried or hidden in the earth.  Whether inside a grave or scattered across etc. makes no difference.  It's easy for Allah Almighty to find  it.

"secrets of the breasts" refer to human intentions, thoughts and motives they nurtured during earthly life will be exposed and examined, sorting out the good from the evil. In other words, everyone's book of accounts will be wide open.  Everyone's practical deeds will be judged along with their intentions and motives.




Title: Re: Hadith on punishments in the grave
Post by: N. Truth Seeker on August 13, 2018, 06:40:31 am


Correct Sister Ruhi.   That lady is wrong. 


Title: Re: Hadith on punishments in the grave
Post by: Zeynab on August 13, 2018, 06:44:08 am


Wa'Salaam.  Absolutely right Sister Ruhi.


Title: Re: Hadith on punishments in the grave
Post by: Zeynab on August 13, 2018, 07:52:30 am



...................

Btw, sister Zeynab, what does "ship burials" mean?



Salaam brother TS.   My profuse apology for missing out on this query you stated long time ago.   

Actually I don't know too many details except that "ship burial" was a pagan custom.    It's also called "boat grave."   A small ship or boat was viewed as the grave.  The cremated body was placed in it along with earthly commodities like clothing, armor, sword, spears, shoes, wigs, spoons, plates, kitchen utensils etc.,  and then the ship or boat was buried.  The idea was much like the Egyptian pyramids where the dead were put inside these huge stone structures with similar earthly belongings.  In all such practices, remains of the rich were accompanied with greater earthly splendor compared to the less wealthy ones.  Some reports say ship burials were only for kings, aristocrats and famous warriors.

Whatever may have been the differing details of different social segments receiving ship burials, it was all bizarre, stupid and nonsensical.  Stupidity was immense.  As of all pagan communities, these European pagans were fixated on cremation of the dead, never burial.   According to these very ignorant folks, burial meant the body being consumed by worms and insects and thus involving a slow process of mixing with dust.  They thought that since cremation turns the body into ashes in a short time, the deceased would go to Paradise quicker.  As in altered Christianity even today, they presume everyone - righteous or unrighteous - will go to Paradise after death.  For the comfort of their own hearts they are on denial by ignoring the reality of Hell to avoid guilt while leading a life full of transgressions.  In fact presently, the practice of cremation (by putting the body in incinerators) has returned in Europe and North America within the Caucasian community;  of course nowadays it's more about saving money as cremation is cheaper than burial within their social system.  The secular Caucasians opt for cremation while the orthodox wealthier Christians may prefer burial.  But cremation is more common.

Many buried ships with all sorts of items have been discovered by modern archaeologists in different parts of Europe which are presumed to be between 1,000 and 1,500 years old.

Ship burial was common among ancient Europeans - Anglo Saxons, Vikings, Barbarians etc. - in the dark ages.   This does not necessarily refer to pre-Christian era.   It should be known that after the first century when Christianity gradually spread across Europe, it was not retained for long.  Several patches of European communities relapsed into paganism.  England officially embraced Christianity as late as early 8th century yet many pagan customs were still rife.   It's also presumed that ancient people of the Philippines followed this custom of ship burial.  It's likely that these people learned it from the early Europeans colonizers who came to the Philippines and forcibly converted the locals into Christianity, but with pagan practices.





Title: Re: Hadith on punishments in the grave
Post by: N. Truth Seeker on August 14, 2018, 05:04:34 am


No problem at all sister.  I also forgot to remind.

Thanks for the info.  Sounds like a real eerie, bad custom.  What surprises me is that it continued in Europe for so long even after they were officially supposed to be "christians."  Rather than following the Monotheistic teachings of Essa son of virgin Maryam, they twisted & altered his teachings to fit into the pagan European culture.   That approach hasn't changed much until now.