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Title: How do I respond to this? Post by: abbottonian on February 16, 2014, 05:44:28 pm Assalam Alaikum Admin and all memebers.
A few days back one of the clerics said on a talk show that"Prophet's status is of an Explainer and not a Law giver".my friend asked me to comment on this statement,which I did and I am posting mine and his comments.I hope you can read Urdu.I would like to comment on his Urdu post,for which I do not have any ammunition to fire back at him therefore I seek your help regarding the same because I am confused. Here is the discussion. Asif Raza:- Prophets are messengers and their only duty is to deliver the commandments of Allah, the message of Allah.They can not give any law on their own. February 13 at 3:06am • Muhammad Sulaiman :- Asif sahib........Itna Ilm aap kahan say hasil kar rahay hain??. Mulla Aziz nain tu apna bairha gharaq kar diya, aap tu kuch khayal karain. Prophets have given laws at their own but they are surely regarded as having been given by Allah Almighty because Prophets do not say anything unless it is revealed to them by Allah Almighty. February 13 at 8:59am • Asif Raza:- Assalam Alaikum Brother Sulaiman.The source of my knowledge is basically The Holy Book of Allah.Please read Surah Al-Haqqah Verses 44, 45, 46, and 47 which will give you the idea if Prophet can give any commandment on his own except what is revealed to him.I study and watch all scholars of all sects and compare with the Holy qura'n and accept what is in conformity with it and reject otherwise.Following Allah's book will profit me and following man written books would make me a loser. February 14 at 4:48am • Muhammad Sulaiman حضور علیہ الصلوۃ والسلام کی حیثیت فقط تشریحی ہی نہیں بلکہ تشریعی بھی ہے۔ یعنی جہاں آپ اللہ کے احکامات کی تشریح کرتے ہیں وہاں شریعت سازی بھی فرماتے ہیں۔ تشریح کے باب میں جیسے نماز کے طریقہ کی تشریح، حج کے مناسک کی تشریح، زکوۃ کے نصاب کی تشریح وغیرہ۔سرقہ کےلیے نصاب کی قید اور قطع ید کےلیے مفہوم حد کا تعین، تعدادِ رکعات اور تفصیل اوقات کو بیان کرنا اسی طرح حلال وحرام کااختیار بھی اللہ رب العزت نے اپنے محبوب صلی اللہ علیہ وآلہ وسلم کو عطافرمایاہے۔ جیسے قرآن مجید نے ہرقسم کے مردار کو حرام کہا ہے(حرمت علیکم المیتۃ والدم۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔) مگر آقا علیہ السلام نے شریعت سازی کرتے ہوئے مچھلی اور مکڑی کو حلال قرار دیاہے۔ اسی طرح محصن اگر زنا کرے تو اس کےلیے سنگسارکرنے کی قانون سازی آقا علیہ السلام نے کی ہے۔ حالانکہ قرآن اس پر خاموش ہے۔ شرابی کےلیے 80 کوڑوں کی سزا کا تعین فرمانا، مرتد کی سزا کاتعین، مرد کےلیے ریشم اور سونے کو حرام ٹھرانا وغیرہ۔ 14 hours ago Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: Zainab_M on February 18, 2014, 02:26:01 am Walaikum Salaam brother Abottonian. Your perception and subsequent answer on the Prophet's responsibility being only to deliver and explain the Laws of Allah is absolutely right. Allah has asserted in the Quran from start to finish that task of the Prophet is only to inform and remind those around him and nothing beyond that.
The traditionalists basically try to misuse the terms 'explaining' and 'instructing.' Indeed the Prophet (pbuh) was responsible for explaining the Quran as best as he could and in accordance with Quranic laws and guidelines - though no one, not even the Prophet, has the ultimate authority to confirm the undisputed interpretation of all Quranic verses. That authority belongs only to Allah. For more details on this aspect kindly refer to our concise post Can there be a universal tafsir of the Quran? (http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=2445.0) For example: "Whether We let you see something of that which We have promised them, or make you die (before its happening), yours is but conveyance (of the message). Ours the reckoning." (13:40). There are numerous Verses in the Noble Quran which convey the same information as V.13:40 expressing beyond doubts that the Prophet's duty entrusted upon him by Allah was only to deliver the Message, and at the farthest, to assist those who asked questions. But the Prophet's assistance in explaining the Quran had to be carefully within Quranic guidelines so that he wouldn't promulgate anything of which he had no knowledge and which was not compatible with direct Quranic laws and basic Quranic values. "(O man), follow not that whereof you have no knowledge. Lo! the hearing and the sight and the heart - of each of these it will be asked." (17:36). This is how much the Noble Quran emphasizes on not deviating from the laws, rules and facts elucidated by Allah in His Final Message. Then how could the Prophet (pbuh) ever construct his own laws after firm instructions from the Almighty, the All Powerful, for not following nor speaking anything about which he has no knowledge? Such deviations of making one's own laws away from the Quran is a grave sin even for a common man. Would the Prophet (pbuh) ever indulge in it and be recognized as a "law maker" in the Sight of Allah? NEVER! The dire importance of remaining within Quranic bounds has been very plainly and sternly stated by Allah in Verses 43 t 47 of Surah Al-Haqqah, quote: "It is a revelation from the Rab of the Worlds. And if he had invented false sayings concerning Us, We assuredly had taken him by the right hand And then severed his life-artery, And not one of you could have held Us off from him." These Verses are an indisputable assertion where Allah Himself confirms that every word of the Quran is from Him and if the Prophet ever tried to interfere with it by replacing them with his own ideas, Allah would severely punish him. In fact, Verses 69:43-47 are enough to invalidate the entire Hadith literature and declare all fatwas as grossly Haram. But it will be impossible to convince the traditionalists of this fact. Sad as it sounds, that's exactly the position today. The originals of Islam (which is ONLY the Quran) being shrouded with layers and layers of deception and bid'ah of Hadith, fatwas and eventually the appalling concepts of Shariah which the Muslim clerics have built by giving the Prophet a new dimension unwarranted in the Quran .. which is portrayal of the Prophet as a lawmaker rather than a law deliverer. Acknowledgement of the Quranic confirmation that the Prophet was only a messenger who never said anything on his own other than what was inspired to him and consequently never preached anything outside the framework of the Quran will be disastrous for the mullahs. It would amount to their own admission of the false nature of Hadith and Shariah which are full of contents that brazenly clash with the Quran by using the Prophet as leverage. You could keep arguing with them forever, they will never agree with you, even thought at heart they know they are wrong & phoney. Admission of this fact would mean being out of business by losing their worldly authority in the eyes of their naive disciples on the basis of their unending fabrications. I would be grateful if you could translate the portion in Urdu into English as it would make it easier for me to connect with it in a more precise manner. Nonetheless, I would advise not to meddle with these people because they are at a completely different wave length. In fact, what they're following is not Islam. True Islam means only the Quran where we submit to Allah Almighty only. The pirated "Islam" of today does not recognize the Quran as the Sole Criterion which itself renders their entire system null & void. "Blessed is He Who has revealed unto His slave the Criterion (of right and wrong), that he may be a warner to the peoples." (25:1). Mark the term "warner." If you talk to a traditionalist mullah, he will tell you that "warner" means elaborating the Quran into commentaries and consequently into extra-Quranic laws. But that is NOT the message at all. Allah Himself states says that the Quran, and none else, is the Sole Criterion i.e. the Sole Standard for Judgement of right or wrong. And the Prophet was required to deliver this information as a reminder and a warning. Therefore there is no question of the Prophet being a law maker. The Prophet was only and only a law deliverer. An imam in North America admitted on a television a few years ago that 4% of the Shariah is from the Quran. So the question is, where is the other 96% from ? That's how deplorable the situation is. This entire idea of portraying the Prophet (pbuh) as a law maker is to shift away from the Quran by making the man-made laws as the sole criterion and giving the Quran a second place. This reminds me of another information given by Allah in the same Surah Al-Furqan which is also a prophecy by Allah quoting the words of the Prophet on the Day of Judgment: "And the messenger says: O my Rab! Lo! mine own folk make this Qur'an of no account." (25:30). Just for your information, I am enclosing a link below where a traditionalist twists and turns clear Quranic verses to justify deviating from the Quran to frame extra-Quranic laws by using the Prophet as a tool for it. The link is a bit lengthy so you can read it gradually in your own good time. In order to know the wrongdoing of the zalimineen, we need to research their misguidance and then only can we be aware of how much they have deviated from the path of Truth. Quranic expressions in translations such as "conveying the Message clearly" has been misinterpreted to portray the Prophet as a law maker. According to them the term "clearly" implies not upon elucidating Quranic matters with reference to Quranic principles & guidelines but on establishing new laws. Needless to say, the purpose of playing such games & gimmicks is only to justify the infinite violations of the extra-Quranic literature that so blatantly go against the Quran. http://www.call-to-monotheism.com/refuting_the_argument_that_the_only_duty_of_the_messenger_is_to_simply_deliver_the_qur_an Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: Heba E. Husseyn on February 18, 2014, 06:25:57 am Walaikum As-Salam brother Abbotonian.
The connection is clear as to why they want to depict the Prophet (pbuh) as a lawmaker. The Ahadith are full of laws and contents not endorsed by the Quran in the name of the Prophet. To accept the truth that the Prophet 's job was only to deliver the Message would mean discarding 90% of the ahadith and over 90% of shariah. This is the reason they persist in calling the Prophet a lawmaker. Sister Zeynab's analysis is a very good one which logically examines this issue of the traditionalists by comparing its utter discrepancy with the contents of the Noble Quran. Calling the Prophet a "lawmaker" literally amounts to inventing a lie against Allah when Allah has clearly confirmed many times that the Prophet is no more than a deliverer, a warner and an announcer of His Message. I also agree with Sister Zeynab that it's quite useless and frankly a complete waste of time talking to such folks. That's why we made this forum into a read-only board because such mad traditionalists were constantly coming and driving us nuts. Btw, brother, how is your wife's health? May Allah (The Highest) heal her and keep her comfortable. Ameen. Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: muslima on February 18, 2014, 09:01:12 pm salamem bro and everyone
so that's the video and Mullah Abdul Aziz said prophet Muhammad can't make law !!mulana is right Allah is alone lawmaker . Prophet Muhammad PBUH can't Make Laws Mullah Abdul Aziz http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQM94XRiitI let's try ! urdu text translation (it may be not 100 percent perfect ) and answers حضور علیہ الصلوۃ والسلام کی حیثیت فقط تشریحی ہی نہیں بلکہ تشریعی بھی ہے۔ Prophet's status is Not Only an exploratory but also a Shariah lawmakker ? answer ! He (pbuh) was warner.& teacher NOT lawmaker تشریح کے باب میں جیسے نماز کے طریقہ کی تشریح، He taught us / explain us the methode of salat , answer ! yes He(pbuh) but NOT hadith HADITH AND SALAAT http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=4032.0 حج کے مناسک کی تشریح، He (pbuh) Interpret the rituals of Hajj, What does the Quran say about Hajj? http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=2418.0 زکوۃ کے نصاب کی تشریح interpretation of the zakat curriculum... Charith (Zakah) as given in the Noble Quran. http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=2309.0 in addition read about sadaqa also Zakat, Sadaqa & Qarz-e-Hasana, Who encourages Sadaqa Quran OR hadith ? http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=4388.0 ۔سرقہ کےلیے نصاب کی قید سرقہ punishment/ penalty of theft ??? Punishment for theft http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=1344.0 اور قطع ید کےلیے مفہوم حد کا تعین what is قطع ید ?? قطع کلام / Interruptions/ INTERPOSE OR kinship/ قطع کلامی/ قطع تعلق (stop talking to) one another, or breaking-off ties with their close or relations or relatives ? kinship? And if two parties of believers fall to fighting, then make peace between them. And if one party of them doeth wrong to the other, fight ye that which doeth wrong till it return unto the ordinance of Allah; then, if it return, make peace between them justly, and act equitably. Lo! Allah loveth the equitable.49:9 The believers are naught else than brothers. Therefore make peace between your brethren and observe your duty to Allah that haply ye may obtain mercy.49:10 Pickthall 13:26 And those who break the covenant of Allah after ratifying it, and sever that which Allah hath commanded should be joined, and make mischief in the earth: theirs is the curse and theirs the ill abode. Would ye then, if ye were given the command, work corruption in the land and sever your ties of kinship?47:22 Such are they whom Allah curseth so that He deafeneth them and maketh blind their eyes.47:23 Will they then not meditate on the Qur'an, or are there locks on the hearts?47:24 And let not those who possess dignity and ease among you swear not to give to the near of kin and to the needy, and to fugitives for the cause of Allah. Let them forgive and show indulgence. Yearn ye not that Allah may forgive you? Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. 24:22 تعدادِ رکعات اور تفصیل اوقات کو بیان کرنا number of the rakah unit and details description of timing ? which detail namaz timings ? Salaah to be offered 5 times a day, not 3 http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=163.0 اسی طرح حلال وحرام کااختیار بھی اللہ رب العزت نے اپنے محبوب صلی اللہ علیہ وآلہ وسلم کو عطافرمایاہے۔ Similar Allah has granted him (prophet pbuh) authority to make things halal or haram answer : No Allah has not granted authority to any prophet , to make things halal or haram, O Prophet! Why bannest thou that which Allah hath made lawful for thee, seeking to please thy wives? And Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.66:1 Say (O Muhammad, to the disbelievers): I say not unto you (that) I possess the treasures of Allah, nor that I have knowledge of the Unseen; and I say not unto you: Lo! I am an angel. I follow only that which is inspired in me. Say: Are the blind man and the seer equal? Will ye not then take thought? 6:50 Say (unto them, O Muhammad): I pray unto Allah only, and ascribe unto Him no partner.72:20 Say: Lo! none can protect me from Allah, nor can I find any refuge beside Him 72:21 Say: Lo! I control not hurt nor benefit for you. 72:22 Say: Lo! none can protect me from Allah, nor can I find any refuge beside Him 72:23 (Mine is) but conveyance (of the Truth) from Allah, and His messages; and whoso disobeyeth Allah and His messenger, lo! his is fire of hell, wherein such dwell for ever.72:24 Pickthall 4:59 O ye who believe! Obey Allah, and obey the messenger and those of you who are in authority; and if ye have a dispute concerning any matter, refer it to Allah and the messenger if ye are (in truth) believers in Allah and the Last Day. That is better and more seemly in the end. . Pickthall And unto thee have We revealed the Scripture with the truth, confirming whatever Scripture was before it, and a watcher over it. So judge between them by that which Allah hath revealed, and follow not their desires away from the truth which hath come unto thee. For each We have appointed a divine law and a traced-out way. Had Allah willed He could have made you one community. But that He may try you by that which He hath given you (He hath made you as ye are). So vie one with another in good works. Unto Allah ye will all return, and He will then inform you of that wherein ye differ. 5:48 So judge between them by that which Allah hath revealed, and follow not their desires, but beware of them lest they seduce thee from some part of that which Allah hath revealed unto thee. And if they turn away, then know that Allah's Will is to smite them for some sin of theirs. Lo! many of mankind are evil-livers..5:59 جیسے قرآن مجید نے ہرقسم کے مردار کو حرام کہا ہے As the Holy Quran in all its forms is forbidden Dead answer! yes Quran forbidden Dead in all forms .. 5:3 Forbidden unto you (for food) are carrion and blood and swineflesh, and that which hath been dedicated unto any other than Allah, and the strangled, and the dead through beating, and the dead through falling from a height, and that which hath been killed by (the goring of) horns, and the devoured of wild beasts, saving that which ye make lawful (by the death-stroke), and that which hath been immolated unto idols. And (forbidden is it) that ye swear by the divining arrows. This is an abomination. This day are those who disbelieve in despair of (ever harming) your religion; so fear them not, fear Me! This day have I perfected your religion for you and completed My favour unto you, and have chosen for you as religion al-Islam. Whoso is forced by hunger, not by will, to sin: (for him) lo! Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.5:3 Pickthall They ask thee (O Muhammad) what is made lawful for them. Say: (all) good things are made lawful for you. And those beasts and birds of prey which ye have trained as hounds are trained, ye teach them that which Allah taught you; so eat of that which they catch for you and mention Allah's name upon it, and observe your duty to Allah. Lo! Allah is swift to take account.5:4 مگر آقا علیہ السلام نے شریعت سازی کرتے ہوئے مچھلی اور مکڑی کو حلال قرار دیاہے۔ But Holy Prophet (pbuh) has declared spider as Halal , he (pbuh) has mande fish and spider premissible in his making of sharia law :-\ Fish ,sea food is already halal as per Quran lawful to you is the game of the sea and its food, a provision for you and for the travellers, and the game of the land is forbidden to you so long as you are on pilgrimage, and be careful of (your duty to) allah, to whom you shall be gathered 5:96 and he it is who has made the sea subservient that you may eat fresh flesh from it and bring forth from it ornaments which you wear, and you see the ships cleaving through it, and that you might seek of his bounty and that you may give thanks 16:14 مکڑی کو حلال قرار دیاہے۔ spider is halal :o ,ewwww hadithst eat spiders also How ?? اسی طرح محصن اگر زنا کرے تو اس کےلیے سنگسارکرنے کی قانون سازی آقا علیہ السلام نے کی ہے۔ Prophet has made sharia Law ! Punishment for Adultery Stoning to Death. Stoning to Death NOT in Islam http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=1759.0 . Rajam is NOT the penalty for adultery in the Quran http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=113.0 شرابی کےلیے 80 کوڑوں کی سزا کا تعین فرمانا، : :o prophet made sharia law , a penalty of 80 lashes for drunken /Alcoholic ??? O ye who believe! Strong drink and games of chance and idols and divining arrows are only an infamy of Satan's handiwork. Leave it aside in order that ye may succeed.5:90 Satan seeketh only to cast among you enmity and hatred by means of strong drink and games of chance, and to turn you from remembrance of Allah and from (His) worship. Will ye then have done?5:91 O ye who believe! Draw not near unto prayer when ye are drunken, till ye know that which ye utter. 4:43 مرتد کی سزا کاتعین، penalty for APOSTASY one who has forsaken his religion for another ????? what is this ??? مرد کےلیے ریشم اور سونے کو حرام ٹھرانا وغیرہ۔ silk and gold haram for men Why did Imam Bukhari disallow gold and silk for men and perfume for women? http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=157.msg337#msg337 If i am not getting it wrong( urdu text) , it means he (pbuh) interpreted the commands / orders of Allah and also was he(pbhu) a legislative of sharia law ? My Q : WHICH sharia ? Hadith sharia ? the Sharia of imam bukhari which is only compatible with abu huraira's islam , and contradict with Quran ? why u are confused bro ? Read MV posts please u will get all answers inshallah :) , and i too agree with both sisters , ur friend is wrong ! because prophet (pbuh) was appointed messenger for the enforcement of Quran Law /Quran sharia , Prophet did not came to enforce the hadith sharia or any new law of wishful desires , He did not brought the new laws, he has never made any law against Quran , he was an honest , trust worthy messanger of Allah , he did not changed or introduced any other law beside Quran , so called today's man made sharia /hadith sharia , ... he can't do this. Say: I am (relying) on clear proof(the Quran) from my Lord, while ye deny Him. I have not that for which ye are impatient. The decision is for Allah only. He telleth the truth and He is the Best of Deciders.6:57 (Where) Allah commands, there is none to put back His Command: and He is swift in calling to account.13:41 O Messenger! Make known that which hath been revealed unto thee from thy Lord,for if thou do it not, thou wilt not have conveyed His message. Allah will protect thee from mankind. Lo! Allah guideth not the disbelieving folk. 5:67 And when We put a revelation in place of (another) revelation, - and Allah knoweth best what He revealeth - they say: Lo! thou art but inventing. Most of them know not 16:101 Allah says in the Quran 5: 67 !O Messenger, convey to the people whatever has been revealed to you from your Lord; for if you do not do this, you will not be doing justice to His Message. as if he(Allah) wrote Quran by himself . Alif. Lam. Ra. These are verses of the Wise Scripture.10:1 Nay, but verily it is an Admonishment, 80:11 On honoured leaves 80:13 Exalted, purified, 80:14 (Set down) by scribes 80:15 the Prophet (pbuh) is told to say that it is not even in his power to change or alter the Quran in any way 10:15 And when Our clear revelations are recited unto them, they who look not for the meeting with Us say: Bring a Lecture other than this, or change it. Say (O Muhammad): It is not for me to change it of my accord. I only follow that which is inspired in me. Lo! if I disobey my Lord I fear the retribution of an awful Day 10:15 The problem is muslims are also like the other nations there is no difference between such hadithist and idol makers ,un-doubtfully muslims loves prophet Muhammad(pbuh) so deeply but in the blindness of love ,our hadithist brethren loves prophet at the level of shirk ,they can't hear any thing about prophet , that's they can't even accept the truth and talking against hadith is supposed to be a sin or disrespecting him(pbuh) , and i think they are scared too , muslims have understood completely wrong message from Quran history , that previous nation were destructed because they disrespect their prophets , that's not true , previous nation were destroyed because of their rejection of tawheed The Quran warns very strongly against setting up Allah's messengers as idols , must respect prophet but don't worship them Do the disbelievers reckon that they can choose My bondmen as protecting friends beside Me? Lo! We have prepared hell as a welcome for the disbelievers.18:102 Yusuf Ali Do the Unbelievers think that they can take My servants as protectors besides Me? Verily We have prepared Hell for the Unbelievers for (their) entertainment. Urdu کیا کافر یہ خیال کرتے ہیں کہ وہ ہمارے بندوں کو ہمارے سوا (اپنا) کارساز بنائیں گے (تو ہم خفا نہیں ہوں گے) ہم نے (ایسے) کافروں کے لئے جہنم کی (مہمانی) تیار کر رکھی ہے The problem of hadithist are they are mad for prophet (pbuh) they do offer prayers But during the whole prayer their minds gets busy in thinking about prophet (pbuh) ,mostly they forget that they are standing to worship Allah , they imagin themselves standing in ,masjid nabawi !that i am standing in front of roza -e- rasool ,then question arises , am i standing correctly ? how were our prophet would stand ? what was his speed of recitation of surah in namaz/prayers ? in which speed do i recite surah ?what about volume ? How many minutes in prostrate /sajdah should i spent i have read somewhere it is good to be long ? oh my finger's are bit open in sajdah ? how did he(pbuh) opened his fingers ? did he (pbuh) ever ? then ,How many inches he opened ? which distance or gape is permissible ? Oh may be i have made mistake in my salat/namaz ? would it be accepted or not ? oh i am confused , where should i ask ? Here come the final whisper of shaitan , not to worry my friend,ask those who were there at that time , the father of ur father , ur imam's bukhari & abu huraira ,who filmed prophet's each movement via hidden camera, each movements were captured, yeah camera ,it was exist at that time also ,thats why it haram to use camera , don't think about four rightly guided caliphs they had no time but others were free , so they have compiled for ur type of fools , concentrate men , focus, u are in madinah , try to see if u love prophet , u will be able to see if u love ur prophet , we have picture illusions also in hadith stock, accept it because, Quran is silent about it ... yes such jerks are 100 percnt correct , ^:( ^:( Quran does not contain any nonsense for such losers . ^:( ALLAH is the only law-maker,legislator.Allah has given us laws which we have to implement as His subordinate on our personal lives, The Quran insists Allah is the sole lawmaker, Those whom ye worship beside Him are but names which ye have named, ye and your fathers. Allah hath revealed no sanction for them. The decision rests with Allah only, Who hath commanded you that ye worship none save Him. This is the right religion, but most men know not.12:40 Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: N. Truth Seeker on February 18, 2014, 09:13:24 pm The Prophet (pbuh) was a teacher of Laws that were already made for him by Allah, The Highest, which were not subject to any changes.
All traditionalists who say "Quran and Sunnah" .. in this case the real sunnah is contained within the Quran only where Allah has narrated the life events of several Prophets along with their exemplary character and ethical values. 'Sunnah' does not mean what al-Bukhari or al-Kafi write or compile in their books. That is the 'sunnah' of those who write or compile them, not the sunnah of any of the Prophets. Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: Zainab_M on February 18, 2014, 09:25:10 pm Thanks a lot for additional feedback sisters Heba, Muslima and brother TS.
Brother TS, that was a very accurate summary. This also reminds me to put up another very useful and beautifully written article of Br. Louay Fatoohi in which he has described so correctly what "Sunnah" actually means in the Quran. It gives a clear and good idea of how different the traditionalists have made it by completely twisting it along the lines of man-written stories by falsely attributing them to Prophet Muhammed (pbuh) and former Prophets. The Meaning of 'Sunnah' in the Quran. (http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=3312.0) Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: abbottonian on February 20, 2014, 11:56:10 am Assalam Alaikum sis Zeynab
Thank you very much for such an eye opening reply. I did translate the Urdu portion into English and while looking at sister Muslima's translation which is same as mine except for using different English words.Alhamdulillah and her line to line detailed reply with Quranic references is a marvel in itself which I could never have done myself. My gratitude to all brothers and sisters for their contribution and my special thanks to sister Heba for remembering my wife in her prayers.Please keep her in your daily prayers so that she is able to move on her own InshaAllah. By using the word .( مکڑی) I know what he meant it is not for Spider but for Locust. Anyways thank you all Bros & Sis Wassalam Alaikum Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: Zainab_M on February 21, 2014, 05:50:37 am ......... and my special thanks to sister Heba for remembering my wife in her prayers.Please keep her in your daily prayers so that she is able to move on her own InshaAllah. Walaikum Salaam brother. Yes, this is a very important dua which we never forget. Since your wife returned from hospital, have you noticed any improvement? Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: abbottonian on February 21, 2014, 04:31:02 pm ۔سرقہ کےلیے نصاب کی قید سرقہ punishment/ penalty of theft ??? اور قطع ید کےلیے مفہوم حد کا تعین What is قطع ید ?? Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: abbottonian on February 21, 2014, 04:35:40 pm Sister Muslima
This means cutting of hands Thanks Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: abbottonian on February 21, 2014, 06:00:32 pm Assalam Alaikum sister Zeynab
Thanks you for showing your kind concern about the health of my wife.Unfortunately the answer is No.Before going to hospital she was able to use make shift commode (with someone's help of course) but now Pampers are being used because of her complete immobility.Me and my 3 children are under tremendous mental stress.Allah knows best if this is a torment or trial for us.I do not know if I should be discussing my personal matters under this topic but since it is the continuation of our Q & A ,I am replying.Her treatment is going on according to my limited financial resource.My hope rest only in Allah I have no words to explain my agony and I request you specially and in general to all members of MV to pray for her health period. Please let me know how can I quote a a certain paragraph and reply because I tried to quote and reply but it did not work such as in case of a clarification regarding my reply to sister Muslima's question above.Please guide me. Thanks محبكم في الله I love you all for Allah Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: Zainab_M on February 21, 2014, 07:28:30 pm Walaikum Salaam our dear brother Abbotonian. Please feel free to talk about this very important personal issue anytime and anywhere on our forum. You can also start a new thread whenever you want to share information or to share your feelings with your sisters and brothers. It helps to lighten the anxiety of the suffering person - be it emotional or physical - and thus it will help us to earn the sawab of Allah Almighty, InshAllah.
I am indeed saddened to learn that there has been no improvement yet. Anyone would know what a devastating affect it can have on the minds of the loved ones. I can so well imagine how shattered the children must be. A house becomes a home when both mother and father are healthy. I lost my beloved mother when I was in college. And then, a year later my beloved father got struck with paralysis and was bound to a wheel chair for next 26 years of his life. I was literally immersed in grief. But apart from losing use of his legs, he was otherwise in good health, alert and very conscious of the surroundings. I thank Allah for that .. and I'm think of the days I spent with him taking care of him with so much joy and peace of heart. No brother, don't ever think it's a punishment. Allah never punishes innocent people nor innocent children. It's a test. It's just something that Allah ordained in the lives of all five of you. The most important truth is that just as happiness is temporary, grief is temporary too .. that's because earthly life for everyone has a fixed number of days. Despite that, I so accurately connect with you when you express your pain at seeing your beloved wife in her present condition. It's also a very helpless situation when apart from patience (sabr) and plenty of dua, human resources cannot go beyond that. I have no doubt you are providing the best medical care you can within your means. No matter where and how good the doctors might be, there comes a point in everyone's life when even the best doctors cannot go any further and have to leave the matter to Allah. Our wonderful beloved sister, your wife, is always in our prayers. We greatly admire her courage and sabr. We are truly proud to have you in our forum dear brother. Please keep us regularly informed about your wife's health. May Allah Almighty grant your wife, you, your children and all other members of your family and extended family sabr and strength. All of you are always in our prayers. Ameen ya Rabb. Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: muslima on February 21, 2014, 07:29:04 pm ۔سرقہ کےلیے نصاب کی قید سرقہ punishment/ penalty of theft ??? اور قطع ید کےلیے مفہوم حد کا تعین What is قطع ید ?? Oh tu saraqa ke liye nisab ki quaid or Qata yd ke kiye mafhoom ki haad ka taeeun okay sajah gaii :) And Locust. / tiddi / ٹڈی. We dont need to eat insects Jazak Allah kahir , haan tu phir roman urdu main kiun nahi likha bro ? :( anyone can read roman urdu also i guess ,actually i love urdu language, urdu text is easy to read , beautiful to write , amazing in understanding but difficult to translate ,word by word ,accurate translation is hard. my apology to everyone for bad translation . @ I request bro if u ever write urdu again please translate in correct english as well , so i will learn from it , and it will be very helpful for me. ( if its okay for u ) jazak Allah kahir Allah bless u May Allah grant health to our sister and ur beloved wife ,ameen Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: Zainab_M on February 21, 2014, 07:30:59 pm Brother Abbottonian, I have explained the instructions for posting quotes step by step with screenshots to make it simple in the following link at our Forum Feedback board. If you have any questions or are unable to follow anything, please feel free to ask.
http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=4394.msg14823#msg14823 Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: muslima on February 21, 2014, 08:02:20 pm Yeah bro sis zeynab is right , Allah never punish His believers , Allah is most merciful sabar bro :) ur beloved wife , innocent kids are in our dua's , may Allah give u strength ameen
and ur lord is not ever unjust to his servent 41:46 Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: Zainab_M on February 21, 2014, 09:52:02 pm Ameen, ya Rabb.
Thank you dear sister Muslima. Please do keep our brother's wife in your prayers as I've already told sisters Heba, Ruhi and brother Truth Seeker as well. Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: Heba E. Husseyn on February 25, 2014, 11:24:32 pm Brother Abbotonian, here are 3 very short and extremely helpful Quranic duas. Try to recite everyday as often as you can. My family and I have found them very helpful.
28:24 Rabbi ini lima anzalta Elaya min khairin faqir. (My Rabb, I am needy of whatever good You send down for me). 2:153 Inn Allahey mais sabiren. (Lo! Allah is with the steadfast). 94:5-6 Fa inna mal yusri yusra Inna mal yusri yusra (But lo! with hardship goes ease, lo! with hardship goes ease). Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: Zainab_M on February 25, 2014, 11:26:43 pm Perfect advise sister Heba.
Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: abbottonian on March 01, 2014, 02:09:51 am Assalam Alaikum All
Thank you very much sister Heba for your advice but I am afraid that my wife's illness might not drag me towards Agnosticism,which would not make any difference to Allah except myself.May Allah keep me steadfast in my Faith in Him and His book and keep such Satanic notions away from heart and mind.Please keep praying for me too. Stressed is not the word...Mentally spent Jazakum Allah Khair. Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: abbottonian on March 01, 2014, 08:53:39 am Assalam Alaikum
I am pasting here my reply to a friend's assertion that the punishment of a rapist is stoning to death for your review and wise comments.Praise to Allah who guided me to answer befittingly to his assertion. But the most important point and the whole idea of posting my reply here is that I am stunned to note Bukhari and Ibn Majah's narrations regarding missing verse in Quran.I would like that someone posts those two narrations under different topic so that people may understand how authentic is Bukhari and others. My reply is as under:- The punishment to a rapist by stoning him to death, No, it is not.Sir! (Qur'an 24:2) "This is a chapter We have sent down and made obligatory. We have sent down understandable revelations in it so that you may take heed: strike the male and the female adulterers and fornicators (الزانية والزاني) one hundred times. Do not let compassion for them keep you from carrying out Allah's law if you believe in Allah and the Last Day - and ensure a group of believers witnesses the punishment." Dear Bro.I am asking you a question.WHAT IS HALF OF DEATH? If the punishment of Zina is Rajm (Death) then how can we establish Half of death? Please refer to Qura’n Sura Al-Nisa Verse 25 .Here is the translation “Pickthall And whoso is not able to afford to marry free, believing women let them marry from the believing maids whom your right hands possess. Allah knoweth best (concerning) your faith. Ye (proceed) one from another; so wed them by permission of their folk, and give unto them their portions in kindness, they being honest, not debauched nor of loose conduct. And if when they are honourably married they commit lewdness they shall incur the HALF OF THE PUNISHMENT (prescribed) for free women (in that case). This is for him among you who feareth to commit sin. But to have patience would be better for you. Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.” We note from the above verse that the punishment of a wedded woman from the category of 'right hand possess' is half that of a free believing woman who commits the same indecency. If the punishment for adultery for a free woman was ever stoning to death, what would amount to half of death in the case of a married woman from the category of 'right hands possessed' and who was also guilty of adultery? If we believe that Allah Himself is Protector and Guardian of Qura’n then where these unfounded lies about Quran stand? And where the fabricator of undermentioned Hadith stands? Sunan Ibn Majah Book of Nikah Hadith 2014 "Reported ‘Aisha: ‘When the verse of stoning and of suckling an adult ten times was revealed, and they were (written) on a paper and placed under my pillow, when the Messenger of God (pbuh) expired and we were occupied by his death, a domestic goat entered and ate away the paper." The following hadith from Sahih Bukhari implies that the verse once existed and was recited, but eventually was lost. SAHIH BUKHARI, Volume 8, Book 82, Number 817 Narrated Ibn 'Abbas: This is a very lengthy Hadith but I am quoting the part which is relavent to the topic. "... Ibn Abbas added: We reached Medina by the end of the month of Dhul-Hijja, and when it was Friday, we went quickly (to the mosque) as soon as the sun had declined, and I saw Sa'id bin Zaid bin 'Amr bin Nufail sitting at the corner of the pulpit, and I too sat close to him so that my knee was touching his knee, and after a short while 'Umar bin Al-Khattab came out, and when I saw him coming towards us, I said to Said bin Zaid bin 'Amr bin Nufail "Today 'Umar will say such a thing as he has never said since he was chosen as Caliph." Said denied my statement with astonishment and said, "What thing do you expect 'Umar to say the like of which he has never said before?" In the meantime, 'Umar sat on the pulpit and when the callmakers for the prayer had finished their call, 'Umar stood up, and having glorified and praised Allah as He deserved, he said, "Now then, I am going to tell you something which (Allah) has written for me to say. I do not know; perhaps it portends my death, so whoever understands and remembers it, must narrate it to the others wherever his mount takes him, but if somebody is afraid that he does not understand it, then it is unlawful for him to tell lies about me. Allah sent Muhammad with the Truth and revealed the Holy Book to him, and among what Allah revealed, was the Verse of the Rajam (the stoning of married person (male & female) who commits illegal sexual intercourse, and we did recite this Verse and understood and memorized it. Allah's Apostle did carry out the punishment of stoning and so did we after him.I am afraid that after a long time has passed, somebody will say, 'By Allah, we do not find the Verse of the Rajam in Allah's Book,' and thus they will go astray by leaving an obligation which Allah has revealed..." If I believe this then whole idea of Islam crashes because the main source stands altered (I seek Allah’s refuge from words of Satan) Do you believe that there are any missing verses in Qura’n? It claims to be a book fully detailed complete and all that is required for right guidance and religion. . إِنَّا نَحْنُ نَزَّلْنَا الذِّكْرَ وَإِنَّا لَهُ لَحَافِظُونَ Muhsin Khan Verily We: It is We Who have sent down the Dhikr (i.e. the Quran) and surely, We will guard it (from corruption). I hope I have answered your question and inshaAllah will be answering the remaining part soon. I ask Allah’s forgiveness and guidance. Stay blessed. Now I would like to ask if there is any worldly punishment prescribed in Quran for A drunken person?and what is the punishment of a person who reverts to his old faith after accepting Islam? Thanks Allah bless you all. Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: Zainab_M on March 01, 2014, 10:57:42 pm Walaikum As-Salaam and thank you for sharing this with us brother Abbotonian. May Allah Almighty grant you strength and keep you firmly on His path regardless of earthly trials and tribulations, InshAllah, ameen.
There is no punishment involving stoning in the Quran for any crime including adultery. Hitting a person with stones until death was a typical pagan custom which entered the altered versions of Old and New Testaments and then into the Hadith. Stoning for adultery is borrowed from older versions of altered Bibles by the hadith narrators and compilers. That's confirmed. To further put frills of this baatil of borrowed man-made law, the hadithists invented a false hadith allegedly by Aisha as follows: Reported 'Aisha (RA): ‘the verse of stoning and of suckling an adult ten times was revealed, and they were (written) on a paper and kept under my pillow. When the Messenger of Allah (PBUH) expired and we were occupied by his death, a goat entered and ate away the paper.’ (Sunan Ibn Majah, Hadith 1944). This is a ridiculous blasphemy and it's sufficient to prove that hadithists are not Muslims. Allah has stated in the Quran that His Final Message is in a "guarded tablet" (lawh-e-mahfooz) and He has Himself taken the responsibility of protcting it. Unlike the previous Scriptures for which Allah trusted humans to preserve it but they betrayed His trust and changed His Scriptures. Thus, for the Noble Quran which is the Final Message, Allah is Himself the Protector. Is it ever possible that Allah would not look after His revelations and allow the leaf containing one of His Messages to be eaten up by a goat?? NEVER !! It is also ever possible that Quranic revelations will ever be handled so carelessly by the close members of the Prophet's family such as bits & pieces being scattered and dumped underneath a pillow ?? NEVER !!!! During the lifetime of the Prophet (pbuh) and soon after he passed away, the pages of the Noble Quran were the most precious jewels for the Prophet's loyal followers and the compilation of these pages was their prime goal. Whoever has written this hadith needed to be punished. Furthermore, Allah has categorically stated in V.5:3 of Surah Al-Maidah, "This day have I perfected your religion for you and completed my favor unto you ...." which is one of the final revelations of the Quran. Mark the words .. "perfected" and "completed." These are words spoken directly by Allah. Anything that is perfected and completed by Allah Himself means there is NOTHING lacking in it nor have any external impurities infiltrated into it. It is pure and comprehensive. Yet, for the traditionalists, their love for their imams and so-called sahabas is so profound and exceeds their love for Allah by such a long margin that they have no qualms fabricating a despicable story that portrays Allah as being unable to protect His revelations. AstaghfarAllah !! I seek refuge in Allah, The Greatest, from such evil schemes of unconscientious disbelievers. It must also be remembered that in the Quran there are no different punishments for lewdness for married & unmarried people. Sex out of wedlock is wrong for everyone, whether married or not, and both have the same punishment. The Quranic punishment for adultery, whether married or unmarried, is lashing. Also, Allah imposed this punishment gradually, stepwise. Here is what I mean by referring to Surah An-Nissa. Allah has also clarified in the Quran that He reveals every law and information at the right time as He deems proper. Similarly, the Noble Quran also highlights that the punishment to be meted out for adultery prior to the punishment of lashing as confirmed in 24:2 was, quote: "As for those of your women who are guilty of lewdness, call to witness four of you against them. And if they testify (to the truth of the allegation) then confine them to the houses until death take them or (until) Allah appoint for them a way (through new legislation). And as for the two of you who are guilty thereof, punish them both. And if they repent and improve, then let them be. Lo! Allah is ever relenting, Merciful." (4:15-16). Therefore, according to the rules of Allah, stoning was never a part of His law at all. Even before lashing was ordained by Him in V.24:2, the punishment for adultery as clarified in Verses 4:15-16, was house imprisonment subject to forgiveness if the involved persons repented. Obviously, if the punishment was death, there would be no question of repentance and thus no question of forgiving them. And as you correctly cited, the fact that the Quran states that punishment of married and freed slaves will be half if they commit lewdness is proof that there is no death penalty for adultery as death punishment cannot be halved. For further information and discussion, please refer to our two previous posts on this topic at the following links: http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=113.0 Rajam is not the penalty for adultery in the Quran. http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=1759.0 Stoning to death not in Islam (this post was penned by the brother running the site Quranic Path). Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: abbottonian on March 02, 2014, 03:58:03 am Assalam Alaikum sister Zeynab
Thank you for your post and the links, which I already had saved in my PC. IS there any post regarding punishment for a drunken? and punishment for a (Murtad) ,one who goes back to his pre Islamic faith after accepting Islam.? I am looking forwards for the reply. May Allah increase your knowledge Jazakum Allah Khair Title: Re: How do I respond to this? Post by: Zainab_M on March 02, 2014, 04:43:09 am Walaikum As-Salaam brother. Drinking alcohol is Haram in the Quran but it does not mention any earthly punishments for drinking. Of course, there can be a punishment for it in the next world, the details of which are only known to Allah so we cannot comment beyond what's stated in the Quran. That's the only bit one can say on that topic. Hence, there is no need for putting up a separate post because we don't go according to what the Hadith and Shariah claim. Regarding your second query, kindly check our post and the thread: No death for apostates in the Noble Quran: http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=856.0 There are no punishments for apostates in the Quran in this world. That's been very clearly asserted by Allah. Punishment for apostasy in Islam again comes directly comes from the altered Bibles via the Hadith & fatwas. The Noble Quran has given every individual a free choice, and all laggards & kuffar will have to face Retribution in the Hereafter. |