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Author Topic: Peace be with you all, really nice to be here.  (Read 1522 times)
AceOfHearts
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« on: January 06, 2007, 01:25:45 pm »

salamem / Peace be with you all,

Alhamdulillah. I am very happy and excited to have found and joined this Discussion Board. I thank those who are behind the start up and running of the site (namely Sister Zainab, as I have seen you around here much) and pray that Allah will reward you all duely for your efforts and commitment.

May Allah make this a forum successful and a source of true knowledge and guidance of the Qur'an for those who come to visit it. Smiley

Peace.

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Zeynab
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« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2007, 01:52:13 am »

 wsalam


A warm welcome to our forum.

Many thanks for your appreciation.  Surely the success of anything nice for the sake of Allah requires collective efforts from all believers.  Thus, I depend on all my brothers and sisters here for the success of this forum just as much as I depend on myself.

I do look forward to some interesting interaction.  Allah Bless.
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AceOfHearts
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« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2007, 10:20:04 am »



Assalamu alaikum Sister Zeynab,

Indeed, I shall pop by whenever I can inshAllah - we really needed another 'Qur'an Only' forum, all praise is to Allah for this forum.

Hopefully, we can all share are views and opinions here and gain better grounding and knowledge of Al-Qur'an, firstly for the betterment of our own faith and then to be able to refute allegations against Al-Qur'an.

The wisdom and teachings of the Qur'an is seldom discussed in traditional forums - the Qur'an is used mostly to prove and argue secterian issues and to bring authority to the Prophet ie. Hadith books. I see you have already a great number of threads on the forums discussing Al-Qur'an the way it should be discussed. Alhamdulillah.

The more people here, the better.

Peace. Smiley

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Zeynab
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« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2007, 12:53:44 am »



Assalamu alaikum Sister Zeynab,

Indeed, I shall pop by whenever I can inshAllah - we really needed another 'Qur'an Only' forum, all praise is to Allah for this forum.

Hopefully, we can all share are views and opinions here and gain better grounding and knowledge of Al-Qur'an, firstly for the betterment of our own faith and then to be able to refute allegations against Al-Qur'an.

InshAllah, yes ..


the Qur'an is used mostly to prove and argue secterian issues and to bring authority to the Prophet ie. Hadith books.

If these people think they can use the Quraan to condone sectarian issues .. the truth is quite the reverse.  The Quraan totally refutes all divisions in Faith.  I've tried to highlight this aspect in my post "Dividing our Faith" in Islamic Issues board or probably it's in the Quraan board. 

Also, it's important to maintain a rational approach.  There's nothing wrong in bringing to light the authority of the Prophet.  Rather I'd look at it as a positive and necessary step .. but it must be kept as authentic as possible.  Thus, there's no need for the Imams to write Hadeeth narrations 300, 400, 500 onward years after the passing away of the Prophet.  Such a practice is bound to spread phoney laws based on the personal and selfish interest of the Imams or ulemas.  Not to mention, isnad is no foolproof argument to justify the authenticity of many of those Ahadeeth narrations that brazenly contradict the Quraan.  It goes without saying that the beloved Prophet never said these.   Thus, promoting the values of the Quraan would also mean reviving the original teachings of the Prophet that's contained in the Quraan itself.

Questioning the Hadeeth is something that ought to have happened long ago.  But, at the same time, this step should not be taken as a hostile stance toward the beloved Prophet.  That would again be a gross violation and very contrary to the dictates of the Quraan. 

I've often observed that both Quraan alone and Hadeeth aloners have a tendency of going to two extremes.  I think it's of utmost importance to avoid that.  Thus, one really needs to tread carefully to maintain that balance and not fall over completely from either one of the two sides.

Peace AceofHearts.  Hope to see a lot more of u  Smiley
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AceOfHearts
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« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2007, 09:50:12 am »


Assalamu alaikum,

I know what you mean when you suggest how there are some "Qur'an only Muslims" who go beyond bounds. In fact, I do not even consider them Qur'an followers, because, for example. they make alcohol halaal, when clearly any sincere follower of Al-Qur'an will conclude that it is something that has to be avoided. They say Bekkah, which the Qur'an uses to refer to the Mekkah we know today, is in Jerusalem and not in Saudi Arabia! Or that Salah does not consist of prostation, bowing and standing. Some of such people I have seen are in free-minds forum.

That  is why I said we needed a new 'Quran Only' forum. Because I do not fit in with the free-minds views nor do I follow Rashad Khalifa the followers of whom have the submission website (we are often accused of following him).

However, after reading much of your and other brothers and sisters posts here, I am glad and pleased that I have found this forum and that I agree with all your views so far. These views are the natural and correct Qur'anic views on the many issues at hand.

Ofcourse we respect the Prophet, as we do all of the others Prophets and we make no distinction between them in their ranking, as mentioned in the Qur'an.

Peace be to you. Smiley
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Zeynab
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« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2007, 02:16:12 pm »



I know what you mean when you suggest how there are some "Qur'an only Muslims" who go beyond bounds. In fact, I do not even consider them Qur'an followers, because, for example. they make alcohol halaal, when clearly any sincere follower of Al-Qur'an will conclude that it is something that has to be avoided. They say Bekkah, which the Qur'an uses to refer to the Mekkah we know today, is in Jerusalem and not in Saudi Arabia! Or that Salah does not consist of prostation, bowing and standing. Some of such people I have seen are in free-minds forum.

That  is why I said we needed a new 'Quran Only' forum. Because I do not fit in with the free-minds views nor do I follow Rashad Khalifa the followers of whom have the submission website (we are often accused of following him).
Peace be to you. Smiley

Oh!  u r so correct AceOH!  The so-called God alone or Quraan alone people (as they call themselves) actually believe neither in Allah nor the Quraan.  They only believe in themselves and how to find short-cuts for simplification purposes or to make Islam integrate with Western society. 

I spent about 6 months at Free Minds.  I found it to be one diabolical place!  Till one day it almost made me physically sick.  I deleted my a/c with my own hands and took off.  Not to mention, the stuff they propagate has already contaminated many an impressionable minds.  Just like many conservative radicals, these diehards of the secularist group  put forth their false innovations thru intentional misinterpretaiton of the Quraan .. which they bring forth on the basis of their bizarre translations.  I wonder if you've read the English translations by Free Minds.  Except for just a very few that inadvertently might make an element of sense .. the rest constitute precisely the same trend as the Jewish and Christian clergy followed in the past to alter the Torah and Gospel.  Of course, they also try to take advantage of the fact that most of their interaction is with people who haven't read the Quraan at all, or not more than a few pages here and there.  So they go about propagating incorrect ideas that the Prophet was not an orphan, that he (pbuh) wasn't unlettered, fasting is only for 10 days a year and not 30 .. and one could go on and on with their foul intent.

The followers of Rashid khalifa are basially into another sort of twisted fantasy.  You will find most of those belonging of the Ahmedi sect all praise for Rashid Khalifa.  Rashid Khalifa had the tendencies of claiming himself to be a prophet or a deity.  The man was a downright imposter and a misleader.  The Ahmedis were completely swept off by his ideology because they too have been at loggerheads with accepting the fact that the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) is the last prophet and messenger.  They claim Ghulam Ahmed Qadiani to be last prophet .. a man well known in the Pakistani province of Punjab as a phoney and a liar.  To learn about the tricks of Rashid Khalifa, visit this site.

It is for this reason that I put a sticky post in the Hadeeth section titled ‘How we differ from others’ .. “others” meaning free-minders, ahemdis and ismails.  It’s really important to me that my clean intent is not aligned or mistaken with such disgusting sections of the society! Our purpose should be to revive the originality of our beautiful Faith, not to disfigure it.  Enough of it has already been done by the mullahs and imams .. and now come the free minders and qadianis. 


I'm glad to learn about the accuracy of your perception, Ace.  Such insights are rare in today's Ummah.

Walaikum Salaam and peace.
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AceOfHearts
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« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2007, 05:14:07 pm »

salamem sister,

Well hats off to you for starting up this website - all final and true praises are for Allah alone.

I agree with you when you speak of the huge 'deviancy' in the free-minders as well as Rashad Khalifa's ideologies. The prime problem with he free-minders is that they reject history and treat it as though it is a huge concocted lie (as you have said in your post in the Hadith discussion). And as you say, some of their intepretation of the Qur'an is completely radical and makes us wonder if they are truly sincere in following the Qur'an the way they do, or simply look for ways to live the western lifestyle while satisfying the conscience by make-believing they are not doing anything 'Un-Islamic' or not approved by Allah.

The problem with Rashad Khalifa is his claim that he was a Messenger and that two (i believe it was two) of the verse of the Qur'an are false (his intepretation of the Qur'anic verse stating that the Prophet Muhammad was the seal of the Prophets is something I do not agree with). To believe that parts of the Qur'an are not from Allah and are false is down right disbelief in Al-Qur'an.

By the way, I have read much of free-minds translation. I find it to be a good for most part. I don't agree with certain bits like the word "hur" to mean 'grapes', because it does not mean that. It sounded like you found the whole translation to be biased/not representative of the Qur'an when you said it is "bizzarre".

Ah, so you left free-minds forum for good...I see! I asked a question to you in a thread by you once, and I was wondering why you were not replying. Smiley

salamem
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« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2007, 08:26:29 pm »


The problem with Rashad Khalifa is his claim that he was a Messenger and that two (i believe it was two) of the verse of the Qur'an are false (his intepretation of the Qur'anic verse stating that the Prophet Muhammad was the seal of the Prophets is something I do not agree with).

Perhaps you are referring to this verse: “but he is the Messenger of Allah and the last (end) of the Prophets” [al-Ahzaab 33:40]

Thus, the Noble Quraan does clearly state that Prophet Muhammad is the final prophet.  There's no mincing of words in it.   As far as I knew, Rashad Khalifa and his followers do not accept this verse.  For sure, the Ahmedis and Ismails don't in favour of their own modern day "spiritual leaders" .. a practice that I would call downright kuffari and disobedience to the Quraan without a doubt.

As per the contents of the Quraan, every messenger is also a prophet but every prophet is not a messsenger.  Thus, in order to be a messenger, one has to be a prophet too.  Since the Glorious Quraan has openly said that Prophet Muhammad is the final Prophet, that automatically puts an end to the coming of any prophets or messengers in future. 

Actually the problem of false prophets and imposters began in the history of Islam a few years after the passing away of the beloved Prophet.  With some it was a publicity stunt, and with others it was merely a misguided or copycat inspiration acquired from labels of sainthood being bestowed on the Catholic clergy.   Indeed, quite rightly so, they were looked upon as trouble makers and their preachings were declared unlawful.  It's much the same today.  The emergence of quacks is an unending issue.  The important thing for genuine believers is to be smart enough to discern and ignore them.
For more info on this subject check this post at our Islamic Issues board.
   

To believe that parts of the Qur'an are not from Allah and are false is down right disbelief in Al-Qur'an.


Absolutely.  No question about that brother ..

By the way, I have read much of free-minds translation. I find it to be a good for most part. I don't agree with certain bits like the word "hur" to mean 'grapes', because it does not mean that. It sounded like you found the whole translation to be biased/not representative of the Qur'an when you said it is "bizzarre".

To tell you the truth, I did find their translations brazenly carrying an 'ulterior movtive,' that is, suitability as the first priority.  I am sure any conscientious believer will agree that such an approach is glaringly unethical, and opens the door to selfish innovations and changes in the Divine Scripture.  This is exactly the course adopted by the People of the Scriptures .. and as a result today you'll find more than 3,000 versions of the Bible.  Of course, we know for sure the original of the Quraan won't ever alter because Allah has Himself taken the responsibility of preserving it on a "guarded tablet."  Thus, here's another commonality between Hadeeth aloners and so-called Quraan aloners.  They've both been struggling to find a separate channel to introduce their personal ideas.  The former have done this through introducing collections of writings called 'Ahadeeth.'  And the latter through their intentionally inaccurate translations of the Quraan.  In the field of misinterpreted translations, Layth of Free Minds and the Turkish dissident, Adip Yuksel (who's been kicked out of his country for political intrigues, not for his spiritual beliefs) take the cake!

What I consider really important is, as sincere believers with unshakable trust in Allah, we ought to discourage our desire to accept the Quraan the way we would like its contents to be.  Rather, we must accept it the way Allah has meant it to be, regardless of its practical incompatibility, if any, with modern day life.  That's just the way it has to be.  Not to mention, if any of us fail to reconcile with any particular dictate of the Quraan, that's merely our personal perception.  It doesn't really mean that that dictate is not suitable.


Ah, so you left free-minds forum for good...I see! I asked a question to you in a thread by you once, and I was wondering why you were not replying. Smiley


Yeah, I quit at a 'spur of the moment decision' after being inactive in that madhouse for quite a while.  Br. Alen of free minds sent me an email asking if I had been kicked out .. LOL! teethsmile  I then found that Jonny_K also of free minds started his forum named "God Alone."  But it seemed to be basically on the same track as Free Minds.  Later, much to my surprise, I got a circular email saying that Jonny_K's site had been hacked or something to that affect, and no one can post messages but can just read.  That was confusing. 
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AceOfHearts
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« Reply #8 on: January 09, 2007, 10:35:12 am »

Peace Zeynab,

Well, at least we can all share our real and hopefully inshAllah sincere 'Qur'an only' views here.

By the way, I totoally agree with your understanding of 'Messengers' and 'Prophet'. Smiley

Assalamu alaikum. Smiley
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AceOfHearts
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« Reply #9 on: January 09, 2007, 02:55:20 pm »



Sr. Zeynab,

To embed a flash onto a post, do we simply insert the URL link to the flash in between http://  ........  ?

I tried that in a post and clicked 'preview' it but it did not work. Only the URL showed. What do you think?

Peace.
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« Reply #10 on: June 10, 2007, 07:59:20 am »

Assalam Alaykum Zainab and Ace of Heart

It was a pleasure reading the valuable and informative discussions you both were addressing in regards to the Holy Quran and the Hadith, surely an interesting area of discussion indeed.

Hopefully I can learn more from the wisdom and great knowledge of my bros and sisters here, and in turn share and offer my views in regards  to topics discussed here.

Im new here and would like to formally introduce myself, Im a sister from australia im 22 yrs old and I am trying to learn and gain a greater understanding of this great faith of ours. For many years I had blind faith, but one day woke up to the realities of my western man made society and saw it for what it truly was. Through Islam I finally found the answers that i was desperately seeking and attained that inner sense of peace and contentment that i was searching for. Since then I have developed a great interest in nothing other than Islam and would like to learn more.

Thankyou sister Zainab for letting me join your wonderful community of bros and sisters, truly i am fortunate to be part of such an excellent forum. The work you have done to establish this forum and in essence your hopes to convey ultimate truth will have a great impact upon those individuals who are already religiously adept, learning to better understand or have no prior knowledge regarding islam. Mashallah sister, ishallah Allah (swt) will reward the efforts of his most civil and humble servants. Wish you all well and in I hope in time to become better aquainted with my other bros and sisters, who i would love to share ideas exchange views and most importantly learn from their wisdom.

Allah hafiz
  weldem
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« Reply #11 on: June 10, 2007, 06:19:20 pm »

 BismEm

My dear sister, I was truly delighted to read your post.   Thank you so much for your appreciation.  Your intelligent perception of our beautiful Faith makes me feel so proud.  I can only pray and hope that we have many more like you in the Muslim community.  As you must have observed already, in our mainstream circle, there's no dearth of innovations that has made many of us drift quite far away from the peaceful, compassionate, practical and ethical values of the Noble Quraan.  When I think of this, it hurts a lot and I want to speak up.  Though this place is new and I haven't done any formal advertising for the site yet, guests are constantly coming in twos and threes viewing its contents.  That to a great extent serves my purpose.  But most importantly, it provides me with a place to speak freely about the truth, something I cannot do in our mainstream gatherings.  They're too rigidly focused on the innovative beliefs already introduced by their ancestors .. something inherent of human nature and unfortunately most Muslims haven't proved to be an exception.  Reminding them of the original message of our beloved Prophet (pbuh) based on the Glorious Quraan alone, ignites much anger and they waste no time in hurling slanders & insults, never bothering to reflect rationally.  I've certainly been laashed enough and have had my share of it!  I guess you understand what I mean.

Thank you again for your input, dear sister.  Hope to read more of your posts, InshAllah.  I'm sure we'll learn a great deal more from you. 

Salaam Alaikum, peace.  Allah bless.
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