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HADITH AND SALAAT


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June 21, 2017, 07:42:01 am Zeynab: Shukran sis Heba.  Allah Bless. Ameen.
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September 11, 2016, 08:26:43 am Zeynab: Wa'salaam my dear Sis Heba Smiley  Yes, Alhumdulilah, the 10 days of this blessed month went well by the Grace & Mercy of Allah. I wish the same for all.
September 11, 2016, 02:20:02 am Heba E. Husseyn: Salam my dear MV team and other sis and bros.  I pray the first 10 days of the bless month of Zil Hajj has passed well for all.  Hajj culminates in about 2 days. InshAllah.
August 22, 2016, 09:50:39 pm Zeynab: Wa'salam.  Thanks brother Smiley  Sis Heba helped me a lot too.
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Zeynab
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« on: December 14, 2012, 01:56:39 pm »

 BismEm

As-salaam Alaikum everyone.

This topic of "Hadith and Salaat" was first posted at MV on October 2006 - six years ago.  That former thread consisted of very important information with almost 3,000 hits was very popular.  But the points of discussion got a little mixed up throughout its lengthy thread.  So we have deleted the previous thread and are putting up a new post on the same topic with the same points properly arranged.  

This is a very essential topic because the Hadith followers waste no time raising the question that if we don't follow Hadith then we cannot know how to offer our salaat?  According to them Hadith teaches salaat.  But with references from the Noble Quran, we will prove them wrong.  Hadith does not teach salaat.  It is Allah Almighty who taught us salaat and the Prophets of Allah were the first ones to follow it.

I REPEAT:  Those Hadith followers who claim that Hadith taught us how to offer salaat (prayers), please know that you are wrong.  Hadith did NOT teach us salaat.

Please continue reading.

"And if ye go in fear, then (pray) standing or on horseback. And when ye are again in safety, remember Allah, as He hath taught you that which (heretofore) ye knew not."  (2:239)

Look at the underlined words carefully of Verse 2:239 above.  These words confirm that Allah taught prayers, NOT Hadith.

There is no injunction in the Noble Quran that it's physical gestures must be universally identical. And as we know, today the detailed methods of all different sects vary despite the claims that "Hadith taught salaat."

The Noble Quran clarifies 5 aspects about salaat that must to be remembered by the believers of Monotheism (Tawheed):

(1) RUKU (bowing)
(2) Prostration (sajood)
(3) Recitation of Fatiha (mentioned as 7-oft repeated verses)
(4) Recitation of Quranic verses which one remembers
(5) Most importantly, the salaat one offers must be directed to Allah alone.

Now let's take each of the above points in detail.

(1) RUKU (bowing)
(2) Prostration (sajood)
We all know that the Quran refers to bowing and prostrating as a gesture of obedience to Allah in many verses.  It doesn't need to be quoted but here are two verses that elucidate that ruku and sajood were performed as a gesture of worship and obedience to Allah by believers of former times as well.

"Thou (O Muhammad) seest them bowing and falling prostrate (in worship), seeking bounty from Allah and (His) acceptance. The mark of them is on their foreheads from the traces of prostration. Such is their likeness in the Torah and their likeness in the Gospel ..."   (48:29).


"O Mary! Be obedient to thy Lord, prostrate thyself and bow with those who bow (in worship)."  (3:43).

We can be certain that bowing and prostrating before Allah began being practiced from the times of Prophets Noah and Abraham.  All righteous slaves of Allah Almighty bowed and prostrated before Him from the earliest of times.

(3) Recitation of Fatiha (mentioned as 7-oft repeated verses):

"We have given thee seven of the oft-repeated (verses) and the great Qur'an."  (15:87)  Surah Al-Hijr.

The expression "seven of the oft repeated (verses)" in the above verse 15:87 refers to Surah Fathiha, the first Surah in the compilation of the Glorious Quran.  Surah Fathiha has 7 verses that are mandatory in every Muslim prayer of every rakat.  This obviously conforms with the term "oft-repeated."  Please check Surah Fatiha as follows:

Surah Fathiha:

1. In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.
2. Praise be to Allah, Lord of the Worlds,
3. The Beneficent, the Merciful.
4. Master of the Day of Judgment,
5. Thee (alone) we worship; Thee (alone) we ask for help.
6. Show us the straight path,
7. The path of those whom Thou hast favoured; Not the (path) of those who earn Thine anger nor of those who go astray.


(4) Recitation of Quranic verses which one remembers:

Evidence of being directed to recite Quranic verses during worship of Allah are highlighted in Surah Al-Muzzammil where Allah commands the Prophet to perform night prayers.  This could be either salaat-al-leil or tahajjud.  Check the following verses 73:2-4 and 73:20.

"Keep vigil the night long, save a little -
A half thereof, or abate a little thereof
Or add (a little) thereto - and chant the Qur'an in measure,"
Surah Al-Muzzammil, 73:2-4

"Lo! thy Lord knoweth how thou keepest vigil sometimes nearly two-thirds of the night, or (sometimes) half or a third thereof, as do a party of those with thee. Allah measureth the night and the day. He knoweth that ye count it not, and turneth unto you in mercy. Recite, then, of the Qur'an that which is easy for you."  (73:20).


The above verses make it crystal clear that recitation of Quranic verses (as much as we can remember) is obligatory during salaat.  

Of course, beginners who don't yet know any of the Surahs in Arabic by memory, can recite the translation in their selected languages until the time they learn at least a few Surahs in Arabic.  

(5) We must pray to Allah alone:

As already stated, most importantly, the salaat we offer must be directed to Allah alone.  This means the acceptance of Tawheed or Monotheism.  Our ruku and sajood must be directed only to Allah.  This is the concept of Tawheed and it's been emphasized throughout the Quran.  This point doesn't even need a debate.

As long as a person follows all of the above principles, they are fulfilling their duty of performing their salaat the correct way as elucidated in the Quran. It's for Allah to judge the rest, not for the imams nor their disciples.

Hadith has not taught us salaat, rather Hadith has changed authentic salaat:
Here is another fact that needs to be mentioned. You might ask for example why do we perform 2 sajoods in each rakat?   Or, how did we know to offer the prescribed number of rakats for our five salaats?  To be honest, the hadith has changed everything to such an extent that today we have no evidence of the minor details of salaat as performed by the Prophet (sw).   For example, it's possible that instead of 2 sajoods in one rakat, the Prophet performed 4 sajoods.  It's also possible that the Prophet offered 4 obligatory (fard) rakats during fajr prayers instead of 2.  But we'll never know about such matters because the hadith has erased every truth. Therefore most people perform sajood twice because they feel they have no other choice.  Similarly, we offer 2 fard rakats for fajr because we do not have recourse to the truth as to the number of rakats the Prophet offered.  Thanks to the mischief of Hadith. But however, if someone decides to do sajood more than twice in each rakat or decides to offer more than 2 fard rakats for fajr, that is NOT wrong either. If Hadith can make its own decisions, so can we because Hadith is NO final authority. The ONLY authority is the Quran and the Quran does not make and hard and fast rules on such matters.

Did the Arabs know about the method of salaat before Islam?
The physical methods of the Monotheistic prayer such as ruku and sajood were quite definitely known to the people of Mecca prior to Islam from the time Prophet Abraham and his son, Ishmael, came to Mecca, built the Kaaba and taught the people how to pray to Allah alone.  We also know for sure that the ideology of Monotheism and the Monotheistic prayer were gradually corrupted by the people of Mecca who drifted away from Monotheism to polytheism over the centuries between the times of Prophet Abraham and the Final Messenger, Prophet Muhammed.  The main purpose of the Quran regarding salaat is to correct its ideology by bringing it back to Monotheism from polytheism.  The physical method was already known from a long time but the ideology was corrupted by the people and thus they ruined the Monotheistic Faith.

The practice of recitations of verses from the the Quran during salaat was introduced by Prophet Muhammed according to the instructions of Allah.  One might ask what the people of Mecca recited when they learned to pray to Allah during the time of Prophet Abraham?  It's possible that they recited from the scrolls which Allah revealed to Prophet Abraham.  But the details of this aspect are only known to Allah.  We cannot speculate on such matters and we certainly cannot accept the stories of Hadith.

We also have evidence through the Quran that the Arabs knew of Allah Almighty prior to the Final Message of Islam.  In this regard check the post "Did the Arabs know about Allah before al-Islam?" by Shaikh Saad Al-Humaid.

Some other points to expose the discrepancy of the view that Hadith taught Salaat are also worth mentioning:
All adherents of Hadith insist that we have learnt the method and other details about our 5 daily salaah from the Hadith and nowhere else.  But no Hadith mentions the complete procedure of salaah.  Only certain gestures and number of rakats are casually discussed in various Hadith narrations.  And of course Hadith contains a lot of duas and supplications which are not taken from the Quran.  These duas are of course not a part of salaat.  We can choose our own supplcations to be recited after salaat.  As long as our selected duas comply with the Quranic principles, it is fine to recite them.

The culture of Hadeeth narrations being accepted as an official annexation into Islam came around approximately 150 years after the passing away of the Prophet (pbuh).  So, if the argument of the followers of Hadith is correct that Muslims have learned their salaat through Hadith, does this mean that for 150 years from the time the Prophet (sw) passed away, the Muslims didn't offer salaat or forgot the method of salaat until Bukhari came along and showed it to them ??  Needless to say, that's absurd.

Then again, when unable to answer this question, some Hadith thumpers claim that hadith was compiled 150 years later, but it existed and was common knowledge before it.  This view is totally false as we know very well that the 4 righteous caliphs hated Hadith, never followed it and destroyed as many Hadith narrations as they could that were being circulated by the crooks.

Muslims never learned the method of prayers from the Hadith.  Instead, they learned to offer salaat from the practical demonstrations by the Prophet (sw) who used to lead the prayers 5 times a day throughout his lifetime.  After the Prophet, the 4 righteous caliphs led the prayers.  This is how the unwritten method and practice of offering the daily salaat was passed on from generation to generation.  But when the deceitful narrators started narrating the Hadith during the time of the Ommayads, they narrated many falsehoods and it's highly possible they added their own methods for salaat which were never practiced by the Prophet (sw).  Also, about a hundred years later when the fraudulent Hadith compilers started compiling these narrations, they edited them further and also probably constructed many new ones of their own.  It's likely that various rules of salaat were changed by these compilers through the Hadith narrations while they were compiling and editing them.  Let's not forget, the bungling involving the Hadith literature is massive.  The entire literature is in a mess.  Hadith neither taught us salaat nor are we obligated to accept a law whatever points of salaat Hadith has stated.

Why do the mainstream Muslims run after Hadith?
Not just salaat, but the implementations of fasting (sawm), zakat and hajj are all stated in the Glorious Quraan.  The problem with these Hadithers is that they are both lazy and of low intelligence.  That makes them dependent on the Imams and "ulemas" like infants are dependent on their parents.  And again, the Imams are a combination of arrogance and ignorance.  They have never tried to understand the Quran page by page, let alone contemplating and reflecting over it.  They just read the Quran like a parrot without understanding anything and then take their laws from the Hadith or their own fatwas.   So, the hadith provides for them a perfect shortcut with all the atrocious stuff they want in it.  That's what makes the infamous hadith the center of attraction for the Imams and their disciples.

Salaat and all other forms of Monotheistic (Tawheed) worship were coming from ancient times:
The Noble Quran has also stated that the dictates given in the Quran and sent through our beloved Prophet Muhammad (sw) are the continuation of previous Divine Messages from the time of Prophet Abraham (pbuh) onward which the people did not bother to follow and forgot with the passage of time.  Thus, salaat, alms giving and fasting were Divine commandments given to people through former messengers since ancient times.  The original and consolidated teachings of Islam consist of the Noble Quran alone, the final Book sent by the Almighty Allah through His final messenger, Muhammad (sw).  And all important religious dictates contained for us within the Noble Quran are the same as passed on from generation to generation from the time of Prophet Abraham (pbuh).  That's because the basic laws made by Allah for humanity do not change nor differ with time.
 
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« Reply #1 on: December 14, 2012, 02:05:59 pm »

Well done sis.  You've arranged it very well.  InshAllah, it will be still more helpful to our readers.  Indeed it's a very necessary topic.  The Hadithists always start with this question. 
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« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2012, 02:07:40 pm »

And thanks for your help sister, for compiling and summarizing that long thread.  Allah bless.
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« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2012, 02:09:00 pm »

You're very welcomed sis ....
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« Reply #4 on: December 20, 2012, 03:08:02 pm »

 salamem

SubhanAllah , MashAllah dynamic piece Allhumdullailh .Jazak Allah kahir  Thumbsup Thumbsup


word by word  agree with u sisters ! excectly This is a favorite question amongs Muslims who follow Only men written texts,With this question, such people try to justify the necessity and proliferation of contradictory sectarian teachings,all falsely attributed to Allah and His prophet.Muhammad (pbuh) .The basic problem of these folks  is a Wrong concept !! they are confuse they don't even  know  where did Prophet get the salat from ? what is the history of salat  ..Hadith have created the culture and majority of ummah believe these contradictions that Prophet get salat especially on miraj Al-isra and Al-Mi'raj,and number of salat were reduced etc etc  but This is total wrong concept.Salat as per Noble Quran which is detailed and free from all contradictions Allhumdullailh ! Allah is The protector of this book , these Hadithists can't compete with divine book. Quran contain very basic necessary history of salat u have rightly mentioned  Salat was given to Prophet Ibrahim .prophet Muhammad (pbuh)was the messenger of Allah .He did not bring the new religion .Prophet Muhammad was the follower of the Religion of prophet Ibrahim (pbuh) !!   
 @ sis i am adding verses .


prophet MUHAMMAD - A FOLLOWER OF ABRAHAM !!
 

Lo! Abraham was a nation obedient to Allah, by nature upright, and he was not of the idolatersn 16:120

 
And afterward We inspired thee (Muhammad, saying): Follow the religion of Abraham, as one by nature upright. He was not of the idolaters.16:123
 


Say: Lo! As for me, my Lord hath guided me unto a straight path, a right religion, the community of Abraham, the upright, who was no idolater.6:161


Say: Allah speaketh truth. So follow the religion of Abraham, the upright. He was not of the idolaters.3:95


Q:   who taught salat to previous messengers  ?? Hadith ????


Allah is sufficient as Guide and Protector and no men-made hadith can over-ride Quran .These folks missing out the point Quranic verse tells us All messengers bring the message of tawheed. every messengers offered salat. Salat were known in the past to Ibrahim ismail ,Isaac, Jacob , Zakariya ,Musa, Isa,,Maryam ..

 

وَإِذْ جَعَلْنَا الْبَيْتَ مَثَابَةً لِّلنَّاسِ وَأَمْنًا وَاتَّخِذُوا مِن مَّقَامِ إِبْرَاهِيمَ مُصَلًّى وَعَهِدْنَا إِلَىٰ إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَإِسْمَاعِيلَ أَن طَهِّرَا بَيْتِيَ لِلطَّائِفِينَ وَالْعَاكِفِينَ وَالرُّكَّعِ السُّجُودِ
 
 
 And when We made the House (at Makka) a resort for mankind and sanctuary, (saying): Take as your place of worship the place where Abraham stood (to pray). And We imposed a duty upon Abraham and Ishmael, (saying): Purify My house for those who go around and those who meditate therein and those who bow down and prostrate themselves (in worship).2:125


وَوَهَبْنَا لَهُ إِسْحَاقَ وَيَعْقُوبَ نَافِلَةً وَكُلًّا جَعَلْنَا صَالِحِينَ .
And We bestowed upon him Isaac, and Jacob as a grandson. Each of them We made righteous.21:72


وَجَعَلْنَاهُمْ أَئِمَّةً يَهْدُونَ بِأَمْرِنَا وَأَوْحَيْنَا إِلَيْهِمْ فِعْلَ الْخَيْرَاتِ وَإِقَامَ الصَّلَاةِ وَإِيتَاءَ الزَّكَاةِ وَكَانُوا لَنَا عَابِدِينَ
 
And We made them chiefs who guide by Our command, and We inspired in them the doing of good deeds and the right establishment of worship and the giving of alms, and they were worshippers of Us (alone).21:73


 وَأَوْحَيْنَا إِلَىٰ مُوسَىٰ وَأَخِيهِ أَن تَبَوَّآ لِقَوْمِكُمَا بِمِصْرَ بُيُوتًا وَاجْعَلُوا بُيُوتَكُمْ قِبْلَةً وَأَقِيمُوا الصَّلَاةَ وَبَشِّرِ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ
 
And We inspired Moses and his brother, (saying): Appoint houses for your people in Egypt and make your houses oratories, and establish worship. And give good news to the believers.10:87
 
Prophet Moses (pbuh) was also commanded by Allah for the establishment of Salat in congregation.


وَجَعَلَنِي مُبَارَكًا أَيْنَ مَا كُنتُ وَأَوْصَانِي بِالصَّلَاةِ وَالزَّكَاةِ مَا دُمْتُ حَيًّا
 
Prophet isa said And He has made me blessed )


And hath made me blessed wheresoever I may be, and hath enjoined upon me prayer and almsgiving so long as I remain alive,19:31.


فَنَادَتْهُ الْمَلَائِكَةُ وَهُوَ قَائِمٌ يُصَلِّي فِي الْمِحْرَابِ أَنَّ اللَّهَ يُبَشِّرُكَ بِيَحْيَىٰ مُصَدِّقًا بِكَلِمَةٍ مِّنَ اللَّهِ وَسَيِّدًا وَحَصُورًا وَنَبِيًّا مِّنَ الصَّالِحِينَ
 
he (Zakariya) was standing in prayer)
 
And the angels called to him as he stood praying in the sanctuary: Allah giveth thee glad tidings of (a son whose name is) John, (who cometh) to confirm a word from Allah lordly, chaste, a prophet of the righteous 3:39


Q: Can any one tell me what was ,and what is still the purpose of congregation prayers ???


وَأَقِيمُوا الصَّلَاةَ وَآتُوا الزَّكَاةَ وَارْكَعُوا مَعَ الرَّاكِعِينَ
 
Establish worship, pay the poor-due, and bow your heads with those who bow (in worship).2:43

(Talking to the children of Israel Follow the practices ...and bow your heads with those who bow (in worship).

 

وَارْكَعُوا مَعَ الرَّاكِعِينَ 2:43   


and bow your heads with those who bow (in worship).2:43
 

In a dialogue with the Children of Israel, one notes the instruction in the Quran for them to ''bow with those that bow' 2:43


This act of congregational obedience finds historic roots.It is very clear from Quranic perspective, that the order of congregational prayer was from Allah and well established amongst monotheistic's of earlier revelations before the advent of Prophet Muhammad and prophet Muhammad has followed the same pattern he established the congregational prayer to pass on the salat method  In this regard the requirement of congregational worship was in general that it would have become entrenched into practice and this system sequence is still goes on

Q:  How come the prectice of salat came through genereation to genetration  ?

And enjoin upon thy people worship, and be constant therein.We ask not of thee a provision: We provided for thee. And the sequel is for righteousness 20:132  

I wish they once read Quran, understand the divine wisdom! Why was revealed of the order congregation prayers ?? more people can offer salat together,Old and young at the same time can learn to learn perform salat and can be able to pass on the method  '' generation to generation as righteous followers  ,pious people , companions ,caliphs did. ''focus on establishing salat and also order ur family ,command ur household,and community to establish salat generation to generation.'' And enjoin prayer upon your family [and people] and be steadfast therein 20:132, Learning the salat from practice is still the same parents do not give written method to learn salat .children's learn from their parents in fact 3 year old child begins to learn the salat method by following of his mother.


Now my question is to ulma's  and whoever deny the demostration prectice of salat came through genereation to genetration !!
 
Q:where from the Traweeh come ???
 

Traweeh nither mention in Quran nor mention by Name in any hadith .so u called some authentic hadiths .No where.

mostly ulmas and hadithists reply u back !!
since we know that the caliphs /campanions of prophet (pbuh)performed traweeh, it is ample evidence for it being sunnah. so it means Traweeh is a practices followed by the caliphs . The precedent set by the Prophet (pbuh and his Household ) and was continued by his Companions and subequent generations after him. In every generation, !!

Q:The people from the household of prophet (pbuh) and rightly guided caliphs and their household did not performed salat ??? if traweeh was continued by prophet's Companions and subequent generations after him.then why don't u hadithist folk accept the truth where from salat come ? why giving credit to hadith ???  Angry
hadith books does not contain illustration for salat or video clips showing how the prophets observed their salat .Quran Verse 16:123 is a direct proof that all religious practices in Islam were intact when prophet Muhammad was born. Thus, he was enjoined to "follow the religion of Abraham."smilarly  If I ask u to ride a bicycle , it is assumed that u know what a bicycle is and u know or learn from others how to ride it or he /she or i  will demonstrate to u. if mother  want to teach her daughter how to knead the dough then mother must demonstrate for her .Demonstration is basic rule of pratice  ! even now these days when the corrupted hadiths are available parents does not give hadith book to 7 or 8 year old child to learn how to offer salat .. child learn from the pratice of his parents ,father take his child to the mosque to show how to pray in manners .Ignorant of the fact that prophet Ibrahim observed the contact prayers  many contemporary muslims challenge Allah by asking where we can find the number of units in each contact prayer. Ignorant of the fact that Allah claimed Quran to be complete , they do not see that ALL religious practices of Submission/Monotheism were established and practiced before the Quranic revelation. Allah  Himself taught every messangers  and prophets ordered to establish the system of Salat in congregation , and method pass on by the wisdom of Allah via congregation prayers .Prophet Muhammad was died Not the entire ummah  died .MEN WRTTEN Hadith can not take any credit on teaching salat .hadithists, scholars subsequently fabricated stories in an attempt to erase any similarities between themselves and the mushriks.


The Ironic question about absence of rakat unit


Q: what is salat ??? The purpose of prayer/salat is to be close to Allah OR counting rakat .?

.Salat is complete surrender to the power of our Creator, head Bowing in reverence to the Lord ,it is more important than the number of rakat.The purpose of prayer is to be close to Allah, not the counting of rakah units ..And Our Creator knows us before He created us !!

salat is not obliged only for ,imam of mosque ,ulma's , mufiti ,job less men ,retired old men or Women sitting at home. Be realistic and ask urself !! and answer me ??

 In this machine era Even in muslim country how many man's offer complete  salat in office ?? how many girls and boys offer salat in school ,college ,university ?? how many womens offer salat in working hours (on job) ?? yes some are really punctual and guardian in their salat .so they just offer fard/obliged and leave the rest rakat  units  ?? Now think about it ?

If Allah had mention or fixed  a number of rakat unit in Quran could we reduce ?? then it could be an obliged  ? could we change ? could we make any excuse? we can only assume that if anyone offer fard only it's enough or better then leaving salat because of the counting of rakat unit . ....our intention reaches to Allah not the counting of rakat unit ....Prayer is an extremely personal connection with Allah which can penetrate the depths of one's current state of mind and emotions. . I feel is far more meaningful then a robotic ritual prayer in a vernacular that is incomprehensible. Reasons why salat may not be achieving much for the many Muslims of today may be because it has become ritualized, heaped with sectarianism and has lost much of the purpose that was once intended.The number of prayers is not as important as is the commitment behind the prayer when a prayer is enacted Although a number of prayers have been enjoined on believers and at particular parts of the day u imams ,ulmas corrupt  sunnah as well . Angry Angry

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« Reply #5 on: December 20, 2012, 04:41:37 pm »

Thanks very much for the additional info my sister.  The piece you wrote was wonderful and it was a pleasure going thru it .. full of excellent and most useful information.

Hadith has interfered with the incident of Meraj so much.  According to Hadith number of prayers was first prescribed to 500, then reduced to 50 and then 5.  The truth is that the Quran mentions all 5 times when we are ordered to pray.   

That comparison of Tarawih was very correct.  Yes, very true that tarawih came from generation to generation.   And you are absolutely right, the method of salaat also came the same way. Those examples of father and mother teaching prayer thru demonstration is one hundred percent correct.

I am sure for a full 150 years after the death of the Prophet (sw) people prayed in the same way as came down from the Prophet (sw).  It's only when Hadith began being written and accepted as a part of Islam officially, was when everything began to change .. changed by Hadith.  It's also quite possible that the method of salaat we offer today is not exactly the way the Prophet (sw) offered because the Hadith brought in so many of its own rules. Therefore, Hadith didn't teach salaat but it changed salaat. 


"The purpose of prayer is to be close to Allah, not the counting of rakah units ..And Our Creator knows us before He created us !!"

You are so, so correct sis.  May Allah give you lots of reward for your wisdom.  This is exactly what I think.  Issues like number of rakat or the number of times one should perform ruku or sajood, can vary from person to person.  After all, from all the Quranic verses quoted, we know for sure that all former Prophets also prayed.  We are also sure that they didn't pray in exactly the same method as we do today.  Yet we know for sure from the Quran that Allah accepted their prayers.  It's very simple to understand but the imams and ulemas just don't.


"Reasons why salat may not be achieving much for the many Muslims of today may be because it has become ritualized, heaped with sectarianism and has lost much of the purpose that was once intended."

Absolutely, you got the words out of my mouth sister.  This is precisely what I say.  Today prayer has become a ritual performed like a robot.  Even Arabic speaking people don't pay attention to what they are reciting, let alone knowing its purpose and implementing its values in their lives.


"The number of prayers is not as important as is the commitment behind the prayer when a prayer is enacted Although a number of prayers have been enjoined on believers and at particular parts of the day u imams ,ulmas corrupt  sunnah as well."

Very good point and totally correct.    Of course Allah has mentioned in the Quran the importance of praying to Him at 5 times of each day, but it's the commitment to Allah and always having Him in our hearts & minds that comes first.  Without that a person can never understand the purpose of prayer.  Thus, there is also a Verse in the Quran, quote:  "Lo! worship preserveth from lewdness and iniquity, but verily remembrance of Allah is more important. And Allah knoweth what ye do."   (29:45).

Btw, the point about method of prayer coming from the Prophets from generation to generation has also been included in another post of ours at the following link:
http://muslimvilla.smfforfree.com/index.php?topic=2302.0

JazekAllah khair and thank you again for your very helpful contribution, my sister.  Allah bless you and your family, always.  Ameen.
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« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2012, 08:20:24 am »

Ameen thank u sis Hope u and ur family doing good ?

 salamem

Thanks for reading and ur appreciation dear sister heba Smiley
u know sis This  is world's most absurd question in my view ....Whenever anyone ask to me. I ask them the same question in reply !! u first tell me where u learn from the prayer/salat obviously from your parents,ur mother ,ur father ? and where from ur parents learn obviously from their parents So Just go back in the same order in which u  learned how to offer salat , u will automatically know how was this method  transmitted from generation to generation .. Then what the problem is ? what's so difficult in it.?  it's simple and easy to understand there is no need for such  ridiculous argument  Angry
They Should be Ashamed of themselves  ,to ask themselves ,to review themselves  , what is the benefit to them of their prayers/salat if they don't understand the purpose of salat, purpose of sajdah  ,what they have achieve from their degree of imam or being expert in hadith ? what they have got ??  courage to  prattle against ur creator ??? U imam's and hadithits do u think u are educated enough to question The Author Of Divine Book !! The  Allah  Almighty for the absence of rakat unit  and detailed method of salat in Quran ??  but if u still arguing then it's ur own problem not our.. without understanding the divine wisdom  u are arguing for noting , u are only collecting strong witnesses against urself because u are pointing ur finger against Quran not us ,u are rising question against Allah not us... Quran will be the witness on day of judgement NOT men written hadith book  ....ur imam will be stand in same row  with their deeds . just we ,our recorded deeds book and Quran = final decision of Our Lord in the presence of our prophet (pbuh) .............
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Lo! Allah hath bought from the believers their lives and their wealth because the Garden will be theirs: they shall fight in the way of Allah and shall slay and be slain. It is a promise which is binding on Him in the Torah and the Gospel and the Qur'an. Who fulfilleth His covenant better than Allah? Rejoice then in your bargain that ye have made, for that is the supreme triumph.9:111
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« Reply #7 on: December 22, 2012, 10:31:38 am »

MashAllah, thank you very much for the addition sister Muslima.  I felt I learned a great deal from everything you stated.  Your perception picks upon very accurate points .. points that our so-called scholars purposely or ignorantly try to overlook.  May Allah Almighty bless you dear sis.  InshAllah, I pray and hope you continue with your valuable contributions for the benefit of all of us.

Thanks too sister Heba for your illuminating comments.  Allah bless.
 
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« Reply #8 on: December 22, 2012, 07:19:12 pm »

Thank  u sister zeynab Jazak Allah . U are welcome sister . I will try my best inshallah  Smiley
May Allah accept our efforts Ameen .. Prayers for u and ur family Allah bless u Ameen .
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Lo! Allah hath bought from the believers their lives and their wealth because the Garden will be theirs: they shall fight in the way of Allah and shall slay and be slain. It is a promise which is binding on Him in the Torah and the Gospel and the Qur'an. Who fulfilleth His covenant better than Allah? Rejoice then in your bargain that ye have made, for that is the supreme triumph.9:111

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